I would prefer to trade Yarran than Kreuzer, and would sign now on our first pick plus Yaz for their number 1. I think GWS would want Kreuze.

Maybe Yaz to Melb as a way for us to get Frawley?

I agree with building the list but I can't see the downside of getting Daisy Thomas unless he failed a medical.

People will disagree but we should entertain Silvia from the Dees as a free agent.

Gumbleton for a 3rd rounder I would entertain.

Trade out Warnock and Hampson for 3rd round picks (if we keep Kreuze).

Only get rid of Robbo for a 2nd rounder. Would prefer to keep and play in the midfield and become a tagger who can get his own ball.

Simmo back to his best, not worth trading now. One of those heart and soul players of the club.

As mentioned over and over Davies, Duigan and Joseph are all gone. Might get a pick 70 for Duigan from GWS who remember him being good in 2011.

Watson, McCarthy, Rowe and Mitchell will all be lucky to survive. Maybe one or two rookied.

I don't think Buckley will make it.

High picks are worth their weight in gold: Vance, Livingston, Russell, Lucas, Watson.....Tambling
I would argue that Swans have picked 2nd rounders who have proven more value than some #1 picks Same with other teams...Darling rings a bell.

Can we get Karnezis who has been in the best 3 for the Lions reserves for 5 consecutive weeks....or should I saybest for months and not getting a go. Can play tall HB, midfield HF. IMO he was their best in the NAB GF...Embley like when he was young.

There's a plethora of excess talls at the Eagles, Bumbers and Swans for a start.....much better than Mitchell, Rowe, McCarthy, White, Davies, Watson...maybe even Laidler too (given he's not starring in the 2's). We are carrying duds.

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Everyone looks good in Navy Blue

I think the 2013/14 off season will turn out to be the most important one for Carlton in the modern era.

If we don't get it right, I have a bad feeling we could be in the wilderness for another 10 years. We have reached 18 years without a premiership and it would be hard to take if it gets close to thirty. If our rebuild ends up becoming a full blown one then this is not improbable.

The expansion clubs are quickly gaining experience and if they are managed well, will be hard to beat over the next 5 - 10 years.

Even Melbourne who have been the laughing stock of the league and deservedly so, have a player called Hogan who looks like being a super player. A long way to go I know, but with help from the AFL and early draft picks, they could overtake us in the next 2-3 years. Their spine looks like it will be better than ours and they will be building their midfield over the next few drafts.

Also, there isn't much talent in the seconds at the moment and we have some key players in the seniors who are getting towards the end of their careers. Not a great situation to win a premiership in the next five years.

Big decisions will need to be made. In Mick we trust.

Sorry for the "doomsday" scenario.

It is obvious to me how important rookies are to our list: Cachia, Curnow, Ellard, Bell, Joseph...there's our midfield depth.
None of them are class acts...just hard at it and hard running.

We can't drop them all to make room for class because we will be lucky to get just 1 class midfielder to join the nucleus of the future Murphy, Gibbs, Robinson, Yarran and Armfield.

Can't consider Judd, Scotland, McLean, Simpson as the future...they are handy whilst they're still around for the next year or two.

We need to add a couple class midfielders...in a hurry....then some more.

As for the spine in the short term, I believe its Casboult/ Kreuzer at FF (till we find a bonafide FF...no guarantee), and Hendo is our CHF with Waite as the lead up tall mixing it with Hendo.......if we can find a player to hold CHB. That's the key to 2014.

I'd hold onto McCarthy to see if anything evolves to benefit us in the long term. That's just a guess that he might make it, because I know that all the talls in the 2's are not.

Easier to poach a CHB than a CHF imo.

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Everyone looks good in Navy Blue

Been mentioned by BV on numerous occasions that Gumbleton failed a medical at Carlton.

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"You are being watched. The government has a secret system. A machine that spies on you every hour of every day. I know because I built it." - Finch

on that theory GWS should have no problem with a straight swap #1 for #8 then ?

Also mentioned that those who made the judgement were the same who were wrong with many of their other decisions.

Gumbleton looked pretty good in the games he played in. In fact so well Ryder couldn't force Gumbleton to make way...same with Bellchambers.

I think Gumbleton is ahead of Watson, Mitchell, White, Davies and so on......I can't see us getting him though. He wants to repay the Bumbers for the faith they showed whilst he was injured.

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Everyone looks good in Navy Blue

I don't know how you get that theory to work...sort of know where you are coming from.

I'd like pick #1....but the question is do we NEED that pick or is there another way around that to achieve success?

ie you say we need, so what happens if we don't get that pick? Doomed? No alternatives?

I'm sure the Swans WANTED pick 1 but they didn't NEED it to find success.

I think the solution and the source of our problems runs much deeper than draft numbers.

Not sure if Boyd is the panacea...just as Kreuzer has turned out that way...he was dubbed the missing piece in the puzzle after we got Walker, Murphy, Kennedy, Gibbs and Russell.

It shits me no end we lost the Priority pick at pick 2 when the AFL changed it to pick 17.
We didn't get the same ride with priority picks Pies and Saints got....only one of those 2 teams won a Flag since.
No guarantees in footy....plenty of hope though.

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Everyone looks good in Navy Blue

Trade players for picks esp rounds 1&2. Only trade for a player if they are a quality tall. For me everyone is for sale at the right price.

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The measure of a life is a measure of love and respect
So hard to earn, so easily burned
In the fullness of time
A garden to nurture and protect

#DopeThenStash

Have watched a number of Northern Blues games recently and there are lots of players in that team who have had senior AFL exposure (albeit only limited experience for some).

What strikes me is that most of them plod along and don't stand out at the lower level. Many look like they struggle at the lower level. None of our recruits stand head and shoulders above this level, as I hoped some would by this stage of their careers. Watching Jesse Hogan in the NB vs Casey game reminded me that class acts stand above, even at an early stage in their careers.

So the cleanout from this bunch is likely to be considerable. Watson, Mitchell, Hampson (or Warnock: shouldn't someone 6'10'' absolutely dominate in the seconds?), Davies, Joseph, Duigan and several others.

The development of many of these has been particularly poor. Or maybe they were just poor picks and shithouse to begin with.

I hope we keep Laidler, McCarthy, Ellard and Buckley, but hey, none of them are banging down the door. I think Bootsma is safe but I'm not over enamoured with Cachia.

As others have said, five years of poor recruitment and even worse development have left us in a big hole.

Mitchell has shown less than Watson and Watson will probably be delisted.

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It's never as good as it looks and it's never as bad as it seems.

Holy mother of god this thread makes for some good laughs.

Just goes to prove that alcohol does indeed make a mess of the brain cells.

At the end of Malthouse's first season at Collingwood, the Magpies traded Paul Williams for James Clement and Brodie Holland, sent Mal Michael to the Brisbane Lions and let Sav Rocca go.


Looks like Mick isn't afraid to trade big names for a better team that suits his style.

..and Michael went on to be a linchpin in the 3-peat defense.. ..and faced off in the wins vs the Pies a few short yrs later..

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..if you can't be good, be good at it..

Light years ahead

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"I had to eat"

and less durable than waite..

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..if you can't be good, be good at it..

I agree with the posters
but

You don't cut Watson until you try him as Full Forward in the seniors for two games
You definitely don't cut Buckley. He hasn't had a chance. He has two qualities that many of our small outside types don't possess. He is an accurate kick and puts his head over the ball. He lacks one quality and that is size. Buckley is the type of player that will be picked up by the Swans and Geelong and moulded into a good senior performer
You keep Warnock & stop being concerned about what he can't do which is play Forward. He is a genuine centre bounce ruck man who has proven himself in big games. As I have mentioned many times before. Our win ration is about 70% when he rucks.

We hired Malthouse to develop this group of "high draft picks" to win us a "premiership" because we felt our time was now.
Anything else is a cop out by the club and Malthouse. A premiership coach of Malthouses experience should be able to do the job!

NO, HE NEEDS 5 YEARS JUST LIKE RATTEN THE ROOKIE COACH.

Haven't you heard.

I think Gumbleton can get his fingers to just above his ankles - whilst Watson it's somewhere half way between his knees and toes.

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"Hence you will not say that Greeks fight like heroes but that heroes fight like Greeks"?

Winston Churchill