Same bloke I think KK - PM him he browses this site a lot

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If you allow the Government to change the Laws in an emergency
They will create an Emergency to change the Laws

You can only tell it like it is. If that's means we're overly negative, so be it. Make no mistake, most will be positive, very positive, when the situation warrants it. No good being simply positive though for positive sake and paint over the cracks.

ie most will be positive when we're winning and most will be negative when we're losing. Fair weather.

Saddington and Teague?

If it's good enough for the Lions to get away with paying out the contracted Voss and Leppa it's good enough for us.

TheBlueMuse's exact word was bugger.

Pretty sure he only likes playing to boutique audiences.

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"Hence you will not say that Greeks fight like heroes but that heroes fight like Greeks"?

Winston Churchill

All the butt kissing of the past few days is great. There's only one problem. They have forgotten to kiss the senior players butts. The senior guys still won't play for DP regardless. So, come round 6 or 7 or 8, when we have only one win on the board, the whole thing will go pear shaped again.

Butt kissing will only get you so far.

And then we will have pick 1 again and maybe pick 2 . Eventually we will have enough cream to rise to the top.

The only problem with that is that we could have achieved the exact same results if we had employed an imporvished, orphan from a random war torn country with no knowledge of the game on a 1 meal/day performance based contract (extra meals/day for a week if we win a game). Arguably we would have performed better on field given that many players would be guilt tripped into putting in better performances. Worse case we could afford to relieve the hypothetical coach of their duties when the time comes (even if there was a 'payout' required) and employ a real coach once we have enough early draft picks. ie we would have developed the list at the exact same rate as pagan except we would have saved over 3 mill.

Exactly. You can do whatever you want but if the coach has lost the players you're going no-where. Let's hope the board gets kicked out at an EGM (hopefully) and the coach changes. Otherwise 2007 will be another complete waste of time. Sick of playing for draft picks. Wins, or at least if you're a chance to win, are much more enjoyable.

If the palyers don't want to play for Denis and therefore by extension the CFC and ultimately us then they can piss off and cry in two year when the finals become a regular occurance again.

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Ich bein ein Carltonian

Take that approach and we would not have any players left (with the exception maybe of Fev)

How much money a year are these guys making? Come on personal pride must come into when you have worked your whole life to reach a standard.

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Ich bein ein Carltonian

I have been harping on about this very thing (Pagan vs Players) for a good year or two now so trust me when I say, this is our biggest obstacle moving forward. Everyone needs to have faith in each other and start working together, you will always have 1 or 2 that aren’t satisfied, and that’s just human nature, but we don’t have and never had 1 or 2.

Having said that, I get really frustrated with the players because they have no self esteem or pride in themselves by carrying on like this for years. We have just won our second successive wooden spoon, grow up and draw a line in the sand and SAY NO MORE.

How competent is Smorgon if he is going to let Dennis pick another set of yes men ?

Good question but assumes Crosisca et al would be a yes man (which may or may not be true).

It looks to me like Pagan is more trying to select those who could not be seen as a replacement option for Pagan should the Board seek to remove him over the next 2 years. Pick those without extreme ambition or a good public profile and it doesn't matter what happens as the Club would need to go through a full process and extract someone at another Club to replace you (in addition to finding the cash to replace you).

Is Corsisca good enough to be an assistant at Carlton? Is he the best candidate?

That's all I need to know.

If Bond doesn't get a spot with STKilda, then we should take him as the coach in waiting for 2008 or 9.

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Everyone looks good in Navy Blue

Boy you have alot of faith us playing finals in 2 years,unless we bag a good Full Back not contracted and have someone fill CHB,i doubt it,we just added another 3 years on that. That statement we are in a 1 year of 3 promotion is 1 in 5 or 6 now.

1 player doesn't make a team. Just beware of Carlos, Bower, Hartlett after another pre-season behind them. Bower is a very similar type to what position Thornton would of ended up as anyway.

This draft will bring us a player for every positional weekness on our list. 6 picks in top 40 (4 in top 20) will see to that.

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Mjonc signing off at 8888

The above players are good options in the future - but none of them are capable of doing what Thornton has for another couple of years. 1 player doesn't make a team but this player has made our defence (albeit an average one). We have guaranteed ourselves another spoon.