Watch the whole game and count how many times someone makes a real block/ shepherd.

Our shepherding is like this..... player one hand balls to player two who is in the open and then runs along side of him with his arms held out like in Top Gun... "Can i be your wingman?"

"Yes , you can be my wingman"


and they run along side each other.. one with his amrs held wide.... alone .. in space...

I want to see someone running and another placing his body in front of a tackler so he has to divert and give space and time to the runner with the ball..

Not this pathetic fairy stuff we do...

Its like theyre kids running around the play yard at school...!!!

Surely we can teach them to do this and IMPLEMENT it in a game of footy.....!!!

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TOP GUN haha yeah we are all GOOSE !

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*(grow - fun - gah)

Yeah but whatabout your whataboutism.

I dont think everything is bad.. in fact we have a nucleus of something very good to develop.. but i want to see more system!!!..
I want to see selfless acts of footy..

and again i wanna repeat myself and say i wanna see some leadership!!!

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Well if a bunch of neville nobodies like ourselves can see this why the hell then doesn't the coaching staff do something about it.

Like i said why is pick 2 doing this and when he gets it he is rushed thus everyone has a crack at his disposal . Let pick 2 use the ball and protect him . Give him campos role for 12 months

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They are being doing it in drills.. but it should be done more.

But were not doing it because Simmo isnt going to start the trend.. it has to come from the bigger bodied players.. and then it filters through so it becomes automatic.

Read my post in yesterdays training thread that someone else spotted and mentioned to me about what one player was actually doing..

NOBODY told him that he was a weak bastard and he just kept doing it....!!!

Now i wonder if he would have continued to do that if Voss and Brown were along side of him.....

Might think its only one player but people by nature slip into cutting corners when they can.. and thats what ends up filtering through the playing group.


Ryan Jackson is certainly not that kind of person.. he would lap them if he could!!!

Full marks to kids like him and Walker as well as Bentick and Setanta ... etc...

Just a stench of apathy around some areas of the club.. and you only need it in a small area and it will spread!!!

and Sydney re the neville nobody.. talk about yourself...

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Well said Pedro..

I believe we are bringing him on well by building a good defensive side to complement his fantastic attaking game...

Wouldn't it be silly to do the opposite? .. Especially when we are still a couple of years away from what we would prefer..

His skills will be fine as he learns to cope with the pressure of expectancy...

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Composure.

Go back and look at Geelongs first 5 goals of the game. On every occasion Carlton had possession between the 50 metre arcs and coughed it up. Whether it be pressure, tackling or the inability to hit a target, we coughed it up.
It's hard enough stopping your opponent winning the contested ball without handing it to him via simple errors.

Geelong pushed their players up the ground and relied on us making the wrong decision or poorly executing our skill. We are quite a way behind other teams in development and they are taking advantage of it.

Whilst most teams are tinkering with set plays and making minor adjustments due to rule changes, we are on a constant evolution of our full game plan.
We noticably changed direction out of the backline and consciously carried the ball more and played on faster.
Our first option in the back half now is switching the play and looking for free players. Good on Pagan for doing so but it's going to take a lot of time.
We have persisted in removing the creativity from the players psyche for 3 years and now we're expecting them to make good decisions.
It cant happen just like that.

Andrew Walker is a prime example.
He is an absolute pro at AFL footy. He gives everything 100% whether it be at training, around the club or in the games.
But he doesnt know what his role is. He is like a golfer with the yips.
He gets the ball and 20 different thoughts go through his head and in the end he does a bit of each.
When he started at the club it was "be more accountable Andrew, carry the ball Andrew, Kick it long Andrew, dont finesse Andrew, Stop that player Andrew, dont worry about Possessions Andrew".
Now it's "get the ball and finesse. Use your footysmarts which we havent developed. Win more ball"

We have to develop these kids and its going to take time.
Skinny and Stevo were very creative when going forward and on most occasions, used it brilliantly.
Instead of relying on them, we need to develop the rest of the group to come up to that level.
That means "allowing" them to make mistakes and being consistent in our message to them.

It was interesting watching Geelong trying different set ups during the game. In the first half they zoned back accross the centre and virtually conceded the first 50 metres to us. In the second half they huddled and played more man on man football. I thought we handled the situation well in the first half but our use of the ball let us down.
In the second half we enjoyed the one on one stuff but once again we were exposed by teams playing defensive huddles.
Like against the Roos last year, we didnt have outriders outside the huddle and suffered the consequences.

We are just coming from a long way behind. The current game requires players who can read the tempo of the game and make spontaneous decisions on combatting tactics.
Our players have had all decision making taken from them for 3 years.

Enjoy watching the kids and enjoy the wins that come our way.
Our first 3 priorities for the next couple of years should be development, development and development.

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Looking forward to seeing our potential realised.

Good post BV.......
Little use focusing on individual players........its the game plan and it has been for 3 yrs.

Synbad is over negative ,but one thing I do agree with him 100% is the lack of leadership at this club.All are leaders seem selfish individuals.Kouta has never been a leader and never will be a leader .He should never have been named captain with 1 year to go on his contract and we should go with a young player as captain.
Even though it was one pre season game the lack of leadership still stands out like a sore thumb

As for Walker he needs to show some improvement in his decision making and kicking this season otherwise the excuses will be flower finished.His miss from 20 m out was shitful.Yeah we all miss the occasional sitter but he doesnt look to comfortable when kicking it either on the run or with a set shot.

Not really. I would prefer to to see two guns go head to head, and would definately prefer that our gun was of his own volition accountable for his man. Everyone who saw Walker's underage performances knows how damaging he can be as an offensive player, the last 18 months has been about a) learning how the best go about their game and b) instilling accountability for an opponent. If a player does not pick up the latter he gets labelled as a downhill skier, irrespective of the quality of the offensive side to his game (Campo being a case in point). You cannot have it both ways.

You can have it both ways because we havent developed Andrews other side....

Do you really think AW or anyone else is a tap???You can switch it from attack to defense and vice versa just by clicking your fingers?
AW is so edgy about the defensive side thats been drummed into him that he has unconditioned himself from the attacking game.. because he knows that if Ablett gets away.. he will be in the ressies.

Thats a coaching @#$%&! up!!!!...

AW will never be a Campo because AW has something Campo never had... a work ethic!!!....

He has pace... Campo was swift over the ground years ago but the last couple he was slowish...

AW can take a mark!!!... Campo cant...

The point to all this is AW has more strings to his bow than Campo ever had.. but howabout developing his flair and strengths instead of highlighting his weaknesses...

AND... as Walker matures he will pick up other things to his game...

McLeod isnt the most defensive player.. but he can do a job...

They dont all have to play like Peverill... just as long as they have a defensive side.

You dont win games by trying to save them.. u win games by winning them...

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This type of slight is alien in the more cultured part of the world - Walsh. Its up there with mad dogs, Englishmen and the midday sun!

That misunderstands my point, which was two-fold. The first was that Walker has and continues to play an apprentice role, spending time shadowing Judd, Aker, Hird et al and seeing how players of their ilk position themselves to be most offensive, which, to state the obvious, is a more sophisticated task than finding or creating space at underage level. I like to think that Walker is smart enough to be learning those lessons, rather than simply considering such assignments as tagging jobs.

The second is that, like most dominant underage midfielders, Walker arrived at AFL seniors requiring development of a defensive side. To consider this an either/or question grossly simplifies the situation. Great players do both (think of the pressure Voss puts on his opponent). Walker can become a great player, and these are the foundation years of a potentially great career. You could of course simply play to his existing strengths and end up with a Travis Johnstone who can be an outstanding offensive player but who's value is considerable diminished when the chips are down.

pj canus .... Travis Johnston and Walker are nothing like each other.
Yes he must learn the defensive side to his game.. but we play a negative . flooding kind of game and couple that with giving him roles like tagging players he will end up being a very dour tagger for us for many years to come..but thats not why we drafted Walker.

So should we give Murphy a tagging role apprentiship too???
and Russell...???

and god knows who else???

Its ridiculous!!!

Like i understand giving him roles SOMETIMES...but not ALL the time...
Stick him out on a wing and let him run... same as what we did for Waite!!!...

Go out and find a week in week out tagger elsewhere....

What were doing with Walker is shaving his flair away from him...

Theyre mindful of it.. but i want to see them change that stupid week in week out defensive role they give him....

Its getting beyond a joke and everyone can see it!!!

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Its time to let the tiger loose.

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"Hence you will not say that Greeks fight like heroes but that heroes fight like Greeks"?

Winston Churchill

say concentration is his weakness. say he ties 100% all the time but his mind wanders, he just drifts - perhaps a good way to help him with this is to make him focus....

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This type of slight is alien in the more cultured part of the world - Walsh. Its up there with mad dogs, Englishmen and the midday sun!

As all above have mentioned... the only way for the boy to get some confidence back is for him to go out and show his skills and class. He hasn't been able to show them too much yet, so he might even take opponents by surprise...

Go out there and kill them Tex!

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Good post PJ.

Kirk, Ling and Ratten aren't bad examples of midfielders who did an apprenticeship as defenders/taggers.

Obviously Johnstone and Walker are different types of players, I am talking about the style of play - ie the blend of an offensive and defensive and accountable side to a game. What is best for the team is a player that will perform when the going gets tough in finals, Johnstone aint going to do that, Voss will.

Russell spent what time he could on the park with the Bullants last year at HBF, developing his defensive side. Waite also played defensive roles in the reserves before his senior debut. Murphy may be asked to do similar work.

Yes, its a matter of degree, but I note that you again ignore the possibility that a 'tagging' role can be a development one for someone that has the engine to run with the oppositions best player each week.

The problem today is that supporters are too impatient for the latest recruit to turn into a champion. It used to take years of development through the U19's, reserves and then finding a spot in the seniors. The opprtunity for us to develop players (Waite, Walker and Russell being prominant examples) is one of the few positives to come out of recent years where the pressure for short-term success was diminished.

As Tyrants would say 'I wasnt at the ground, so cant have an opinion' but I am staggered that anyone could advocate a different path for Walks after he beat Ablett G, a player who traditionally waltzes around our non-tackles, on Saturday night. Not only did Walks beat him but earned a number of good, opportunity creating stats. We can talk about his rushed kicking at times which requires some thinking through it on his behalf, but how good was that handball in the pack in the second!

We all know we've had a lack of accountability in our midfield for some years. To develop one of our prime young midfielders into an accountable yet attacking midfielder is a worthy goal.

To 'unleash' him now as a what - a wingman - while we're still leaking so much in midfield and defence would be short-sighted in my view.

And yes Russell is being taught this side as well.

We don't have other options in this regard - despite Bannister having a few nice wins against mid-paced smart players such as Buckely, he, Sporn, Wiggins are all deficient for smarts / tightness on the good players. If Walker can learn this part of the game and keep his development on track he will become a more complete player and also help us through a lean time.

As for 'negative' style football, yes, Carlton at times plays a full flood like many other teams in the comp and yes we play fast break footy when we can. but when that forward line creates more leads and we learn to work that through from wing / half forward we will be very exciting to watch. The full flood is just one tactic, its not the Plan A game plan.