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bondiblue
PostPosted: Mon Aug 11, 2025 9:22 pm 
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Stephen Silvagni

Joined: Thu Feb 02, 2006 11:03 am
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Location: Bondi Beach
SurreyBlue wrote:
IMO, Rowell was the biggest difference in this game. We just couldn't contain him.
Both Hewett and Cripps couldn't go with him. I keep saying it but can't keep playing both these 2 in the same setup.
When Williams went on ball, he made a difference and really highlighted our Achillies heal. Need him centre and forward. :razz:
Weitering is a real concern.


Absolutely Surrey.

One of Cripps n Hewett should be keeping an eye on Rowell by sticking close, just as other teams do to Cripps, and Williams is the burst mid we need. He has great evasive skills, speed and hits targets. He was the only one, so he didn’t have someone with same qualities to rotate with.

Next year they will be supported by Smith and Walsh, and hopefully a quicker Cerra. Something not the same about Cerra’s speed since his visit to Dubai. His hammies survived but I feel he lost some speed.

Don’t give up on our midfield. I’m sure there’s another one on the horizon to join the group, to enable broader and better rotation, mix and balance.

As for Weitering. He should have played against King, not Young, and if we need an intercept mark, it should have been Young. We play him in the worst defensive roles. He’s a great intercept mark, but we choose to go with Weiters, Haynes and Gov ahead of him. Haynes also had the wrong match up in this game. Well played Dimma.

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Mickstar
PostPosted: Mon Aug 11, 2025 11:31 pm 
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Craig Bradley
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As an interesting sidelight Jed Walter was running around for the Goldy Magoo's on the weekend . If Charlie really wants to go up there then I would ask the question . Walter is a beast . And they can throw in that kid Lewis just for good measure .

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17th Premiership
PostPosted: Tue Aug 12, 2025 2:09 pm 
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Rod Ashman

Joined: Fri Dec 15, 2006 8:22 am
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bondiblue wrote:
17th Premiership wrote:
At this stage of this season, it is good to see a few good things. In this case, Lord's performances and Frankie.
Also it was great to see O'Keefe have some moments (although that ball-drop when he kicked his first goal was distinctly Kernahan-esque).
I thought Harry battled strongly all night. And Ollie has really come on this season. It is clear to everyone, I assume including himself' what he needs to work on over the summer. And I believe his work ethic will help him rectify his disposal. But ALSO, it would help a lot if he was kicking more to the advantage space in front of leading players rather than trying to pinpoint a largely static target. I think a better game plan will help with that. It is a big reason why some clubs look like all their players are super skilled while others, like us, look like we just draft unskilled players.

While I do accept the impact of all our injuries, it should be noted that we were playing terribly even when we had most of our senior players on the park. This year, and last season. I think it is largely a mental or cultural thing where we only seem to play to the level we think is required. So, against Richmand, we thought we'd done enough and took our foot off the gas. Last year, against the Giants... and then, judging by the public comments of some players, they seem to think we have it all under control. As if we are able to just flick a switch whenever we want.


Love your posts 17th but cannot agree one bit with the last paragraph.

We started the season with 13 out. We won every first half for half a dozen games we lost with those injuries. We lacked players who could play 4 quarters. Our depth was and is an issue as soon as we have 8 out injured.

No tam has won a game when they had 12, 13, 14 and 15 players out as we have endured. Injuries matter. No teams win finals or flags with an injury plagued year.

Yeah, you can blame game plan, but I think that’s guessing because we won all but one game when we had less than 8 out injured. Fact.


You know, I can accept that and I hope you're right. Maybe I'm putting undue weight on the 'next soldier up' mentality which obviously has its limits after a certain number of good players drop out...

So, when we play really well in the first half (forward handball, lowering eyes going into F50 etc...) and then fall apart in the 2nd half (static, long bombs down the line and into F50), with pretty much the same group of players as the first half... why do you think this happens? Lack of fitness, lack of discipline, too taxing game style, other? (I think the answer to this question prescribes much of what we need to work on over summer.)
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malbi
PostPosted: Tue Aug 12, 2025 7:45 pm 
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Rod Ashman
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Joined: Tue Mar 29, 2005 10:44 am
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Location: East Melbourne
17th Premiership wrote:
bondiblue wrote:
17th Premiership wrote:
At this stage of this season, it is good to see a few good things. In this case, Lord's performances and Frankie.
Also it was great to see O'Keefe have some moments (although that ball-drop when he kicked his first goal was distinctly Kernahan-esque).
I thought Harry battled strongly all night. And Ollie has really come on this season. It is clear to everyone, I assume including himself' what he needs to work on over the summer. And I believe his work ethic will help him rectify his disposal. But ALSO, it would help a lot if he was kicking more to the advantage space in front of leading players rather than trying to pinpoint a largely static target. I think a better game plan will help with that. It is a big reason why some clubs look like all their players are super skilled while others, like us, look like we just draft unskilled players.

While I do accept the impact of all our injuries, it should be noted that we were playing terribly even when we had most of our senior players on the park. This year, and last season. I think it is largely a mental or cultural thing where we only seem to play to the level we think is required. So, against Richmand, we thought we'd done enough and took our foot off the gas. Last year, against the Giants... and then, judging by the public comments of some players, they seem to think we have it all under control. As if we are able to just flick a switch whenever we want.


Love your posts 17th but cannot agree one bit with the last paragraph.

We started the season with 13 out. We won every first half for half a dozen games we lost with those injuries. We lacked players who could play 4 quarters. Our depth was and is an issue as soon as we have 8 out injured.

No tam has won a game when they had 12, 13, 14 and 15 players out as we have endured. Injuries matter. No teams win finals or flags with an injury plagued year.

Yeah, you can blame game plan, but I think that’s guessing because we won all but one game when we had less than 8 out injured. Fact.


You know, I can accept that and I hope you're right. Maybe I'm putting undue weight on the 'next soldier up' mentality which obviously has its limits after a certain number of good players drop out...

So, when we play really well in the first half (forward handball, lowering eyes going into F50 etc...) and then fall apart in the 2nd half (static, long bombs down the line and into F50), with pretty much the same group of players as the first half... why do you think this happens? Lack of fitness, lack of discipline, too taxing game style, other? (I think the answer to this question prescribes much of what we need to work on over summer.)
We haven't been doing too well in the first half lately either. They must all be injured.

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SurreyBlue
PostPosted: Tue Aug 12, 2025 11:51 pm 
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Ken Hunter
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This sums up what some of us have been talking about all year. Just game plan setup and structure. Nothing to do with personal.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LFI8pOdSOu4
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SurreyBlue
PostPosted: Wed Aug 13, 2025 10:54 am 
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Ken Hunter
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Just rewatched the last quarter and above summary again.
Biggest cop out by the club is blaming the list.
Yes, it’s not perfect but it’s worse coached team in the league.
Not just Voss.
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sinbagger
PostPosted: Wed Aug 13, 2025 11:25 am 
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Ken Hunter

Joined: Thu Apr 21, 2005 12:18 pm
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Location: Australia
SurreyBlue wrote:
This sums up what some of us have been talking about all year. Just game plan setup and structure. Nothing to do with personal.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LFI8pOdSOu4


Quick hands, play on quickly, honour run from behind - aren't these all things Voss implemented in the preseason and we practised in the preseason?

TDK running and jumping instead of wrestling, this is down to player iq surely?

Switching from zone to 1:1 defence in the last, perhaps this is new, perhaps this is also what we practised in the pre-season, can anyone confirm? I note the guy running the video praised the coaches for being brave and innovative to switch to 1:1 defence during the game

Looking at all the above it comes down to players being able to execute the coaches plan, so it is the lack of list depth.

Edit: one more thing, he also pointed out the difference was that we were first to the ball and had more intensity and therefore won the clearances. Surely this is also down to player attitude/ability and not coaching?
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malbi
PostPosted: Wed Aug 13, 2025 11:59 am 
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Rod Ashman
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Why have players failed to follow the game plan all year suddenly be able to turn it on in the fourth quarter of Round 22?

Surely you would drop them if they failed to follow orders.

No. I think the game plan clearly changed in the last quarter and it worked.

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sinbagger
PostPosted: Wed Aug 13, 2025 12:03 pm 
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Ken Hunter

Joined: Thu Apr 21, 2005 12:18 pm
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Location: Australia
malbi wrote:
Why have players failed to follow the game plan all year suddenly be able to turn it on in the fourth quarter of Round 22?

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Because of our lack of list depth and high number of injuries we've had to play too many junior players who weren't able to follow the new plan consistently.

As mentioned, maybe Voss did work extra elements into the new game plan like 1:1 defence, but a lot of what we saw was practised in the pre season, and we have seen it sporadically during the season.

Would be interesting to go back to the Geelong match and compare the way we played then to how we played in the last against GC.
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Blue Vain
PostPosted: Wed Aug 13, 2025 12:42 pm 
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Stephen Kernahan

Joined: Mon Feb 28, 2005 10:35 am
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SurreyBlue wrote:
This sums up what some of us have been talking about all year. Just game plan setup and structure. Nothing to do with personal.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LFI8pOdSOu4


C'mon Surrey, how can it have nothing to do with personnel? The injury ladder has consistently correlated with the success ladder for years.
If Personnel is irrelevant, could Chris Scott take his VFL team to an AFL premiership? Wouldn't go close to making top 16.
Personnel is always critical. Good players make good decisions.

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Mickstar
PostPosted: Wed Aug 13, 2025 1:07 pm 
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Craig Bradley
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Blue Vain wrote:
SurreyBlue wrote:
This sums up what some of us have been talking about all year. Just game plan setup and structure. Nothing to do with personal.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LFI8pOdSOu4


C'mon Surrey, how can it have nothing to do with personnel? The injury ladder has consistently correlated with the success ladder for years.
If Personnel is irrelevant, could Chris Scott take his VFL team to an AFL premiership? Wouldn't go close to making top 16.
Personnel is always critical. Good players make good decisions.


Truest thing in football BV . Good players make good coaches . Cattle on the park . You cant pull your socks up if you are not wearing any . And the fact is even if everyone was available i think we would fall a smidgin short . Like the new CEO said , we are looking to add talent . Talking about the new CEO thank fruck he aint the maniacal toecutter some where hoping for . The bloke has got a cool head on his shoulders .

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SurreyBlue
PostPosted: Wed Aug 13, 2025 10:49 pm 
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Ken Hunter
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Blue Vain wrote:
SurreyBlue wrote:
This sums up what some of us have been talking about all year. Just game plan setup and structure. Nothing to do with personal.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LFI8pOdSOu4


C'mon Surrey, how can it have nothing to do with personnel? The injury ladder has consistently correlated with the success ladder for years.
If Personnel is irrelevant, could Chris Scott take his VFL team to an AFL premiership? Wouldn't go close to making top 16.
Personnel is always critical. Good players make good decisions.


Agree.
My reference was to this one game - same personal with complete different structures and setups making a difference in the one game.
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