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PostPosted: Sat Jun 04, 2005 5:48 am 
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Harry Vallence
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Well another week has passed since my original post last week, and thought it was time too convey my thoughts again.

Last week I covered the following:

- How Carlton had given me more good times than bad in my life

- How we can use Richmond as a model for how things can change very quickly over a summer.

This week, my observation on continual thoughts of tanking games versus draft picks versus building confidence versus supporters and members reactions.

There is no doubt that this is a very emotional and sensitive issue, there is no right nor wrong or is there a crystal ball which dictates our best option.

What we do have though is historical information, which combined with the ability to understand exactly what finishing in different positions on the ladder mean to us in terms of draft picks at the end of the year .

This is invaluable, and with proper communication from our coach, we can be satisfied.

What do I mean???

The simple facts are that as we currently sit we do not have an ultra competitive team. Draft penalties have crippled our development, our recruitment over 5 years has crippled our development, and team performance has reflected in our views of our younger draftees.

( Look at Travis Cloke- absolutely fantastic, but at the moment playing in a team that is playing with renewed confidence and enthusiasm. This is does not mean they will win a flag before us.)

Option 1

We have to be honest with ourselves, if we win another 5 or 6 games out of 12 (which is highly unlikely) , we place ourselves potentially out of first pick in the draft and PSD. That simply will put us in limbo for another 5 years. Our first pick could be 2 or 3, our second 18 or 19, and our pick in the PSD could be number 3. FACT.

Option 2

If we finish where we are our pride may be dented a little, but a first pick, a low second pick, and first pick in the PSD can be a massive turn around for the club. Not too mention possibly a priority pick.

We have money to play with this year for the PSD.
If we have multiple picks we have the ability with a young list to use a late pick on an experienced player (calculated risk) even from the WAFL, VFL, SANFL, or one of our regional leagues. FACT.

Selling our Options

The coaches post game conference was the first example of reinforcement of where a good couple of draft picks can change our fortunes.

" Give me a couple of good draft picks and I will give you pretty football"

We need this subtle reinforcement.

As a team we can still improve, and certain players can develop, whilst finishing in a position that gives us ultimate strength and bargaining power in the draft this year.

As long as we know all the options eveyone can make an educated decision, but just think, in 12 weeks time this hardship can be behind us, and we can move into a new era of the Carlton Football Club.

If we win 3 - 6 games, we could still be posting next season about first picks who are playing at other clubs, when we really may shoot ourselves in the foot.

I don't like losing, but shit, if we improve and are ultra competitive, but still finish last with a priority pick, I won't be unhappy.

If we win a few games, don't get those early picks, and remain in limbo for the next 5 years treading water, that will do more damage to our membership, supporters and sponsors than a bad few weeks this year which can be turned around come October / November / December.

Either way we will not be playing finals football this year, but how long it is until we do is in our hands.

PS - I was told if you win under 3 games you get another prioirty pick, but have been unable to clarify this. Can anyone point me in the right direction to find out.

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PostPosted: Sat Jun 04, 2005 7:55 am 
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Bruce Doull
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I don't like the "Give me one or 2 low picks in the draft and suddenly all will be good" attitude.

We're in the process of rebuilding in a number of ways:
• In terms of our manpower on the field; and
• Attitude both on and off the field.

We've seen how poor we can be when our skills are below-average. Combine that with bad attitude, and we are truly shocking. Remember, we played good, attractive, fast footy when our attitude was high.

Part of the re-organisation of players after this season will be to not only improve our playing stock, but to improve our attitude stocks also. There's no point having skilled, yet sulky players in the midst of developing youngsters.

About your point of Richmond as an example:
Yes, they've had a great turnaround in a very short space of time. IMO, only a small part of this has been due to the influx of quality draftees. They will assert their quality next year or later. Judgement on how far Richmond has truly come has to be left til the end of this season. With Brown's injury, Richmond has had a lot of air taken out of their sails, as he seemed to be a huge part of their resurgence, and his loss will see them lose matches that they otherwise would have won.

But, to your point, I'm keeping the faith. They're my team, and I'll support them through thick and thin.

I look forward to the next Blue Wave.

PS: contact the AFL about your PP question. try emailing football.operations@afl.com.au (maybe it's without the ".")

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PostPosted: Sat Jun 04, 2005 9:48 am 
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Ken Hunter
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Location: Coburg
sorry but the club will never, ever deliberately play for draft picks, and now you want them to play for the mythical 3rd draft pick (which like most things mythic, does not exist) and now the PSD is also our savior and so is that new sticthing in the jumpers (hear we'll run faster with it).

Fair dinkum if this club ever, ever played for draft picks then i am out of here simple.

We bag Collingwood and rightly so, but gee they haven't done too badly the past two weeks have they. Knocked of the two big guns (yes West coast was ready for it and Gelloing had a shocker blah blah blah) the point is no one is as far away as we think. That inlucdes us.

We need somelayers, don't get me wrong, but I think all this oh we need to finish last its the only eway we'll be done the bottom for ever the club will fold my pants are too loose my hair is failling out crap is just that - supporters who haven't got a clue.

I underatnd the lure of those picks, its why i hate them so, but the club should not, ever, design a plan to ensure they finish last. if it happens, it happens. If it doesn't, so what, you get your picks, bring the kids into the club and keep working and keep working.

No one said we wwere going to find it easy after the penalties and after the recruiting under parkin. So it isn't easy uey again we have this habit of taking our eyes off the ball and searching for the superglue fix. Problem with superglue fixes is that everything gets stuck together and nothging is ever really fixed.

So we play as hard as we can, we coach as well as we can and we try to win every game.

If we do I'll be rapot. if we don;t then the poicks will be extremely handy and well deserved, but we do not, ever, design a strategy for this club that involves getting the picks. That is ga ga land.

Look at it this way.

This week we may beat Sydney. Next week Brisbane - both are possibilities (or conversely we might get slaughtered in both) that points us 4.5 and 1 game away from losing them. It may happen.And with those two wins some confidence and stuff well we'd win more than 1 more I reckon

Forget the early picks, wait til the end of the season and see what happens.

<Me I head off today to support my team and urge them to win. if they do I'll be happy.

if they don't then that tragic habit of consoling myself with the shitty PP's will go on for another week. But thats to ease the pian and that's fine, just not the direction i want the club to take. Ever.

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PostPosted: Sat Jun 04, 2005 10:59 am 
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Rod Ashman

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The fact of the matter is that we do need players of a very high quality that can pretty much be walk up starts to the team. You only get players like this two ways :

1. High draft picks.
2. Trading or picking up via the psd a quality player that wants to change clubs.

These sort of players are either gone by the later draft picks or they are available only as an relatively raw and untried youngster needing a few years development.

The other high risk way of getting quality into the team is by recycling players - and weve already done that havent we...

So, I dont want to tank games, but I do want to play the undeveloped youth that we have in order to secure our future.

For the abovementioned reasons, I dont mind if we finish on or near the bottom of the ladder in doing this.

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PostPosted: Sat Jun 04, 2005 11:15 am 
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Alex Jesaulenko
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The way to build a team is to use your 1st and 2nd round draft picks on young players and to develop them. Where the draft picks exactly are is neither here nor there.

The culture of developing youth and using our highest picks to do it is the most important factor in building a strong team. And what db said Hard Work, you can have all the skill in the world, but it is nothing without hard work. That is why we must also concentrate on those kids with the right stuff between the ears.

So far we are only into year 2 of being able to do this.

Whether we get pick 3 or pick 8 is not the most important thing.

Hanging your HAT on magic cures is a recipe for disaster.

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PostPosted: Sat Jun 04, 2005 11:46 am 
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Harry Vallence
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I don't think the club is necessarily playing for picks, but what I have mentioned is simply the options, based on some sought of clue.

Wrightly or wrongly that is what we face over the next 12 weeks.

I don't like thinking the players should turn up and lose.

But, if we miss out on some potential talent (and the higher the pick, you control your destiny further), then no point posting about ones that got away.

And i don't think we should play for a mystery priority pick, but it was mentioned too me, the first I had heard about it, and too broaden my understanding I asked the question.

No matter what I will write a fair and as close too factual topic as I can. I like these forums and as a member love the club. I like too prompt others too respond to thoughts I have and see how they shed their light on the topic.

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PostPosted: Sun Jun 05, 2005 12:15 am 
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Bruce Doull
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going back to my original post on this: Witness today's Richmond/ WCE match, and it wasn't DeLedio or their draft picks which fired, it was the old stagers: Richo, Campbell, Hilton, Pettifer, Kellaway, etc which provided the impetus for their comebacks through the match. It's the young guys and draft picks which will then carry that on.

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