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This type of slight is alien in the more cultured part of the world - Walsh. Its up there with mad dogs, Englishmen and the midday sun!

that is a great article and is all true
but
wouldnt u rather a pick #1 than not

more often than not the first picks turn good
or else the top 5
lets just hope we can get some of those players listed in the article

Very nice dannyboy.

I remember our talent discussion from a couple of years ago.

Champions may need a base level of talent but it is those other intangible qualities that make for true champions.

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Like what?????.... like all the types of 'intabigibles' you cant list so you call them "intangibles"???

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passion, heart, determination, courage, belief, strength, character, discipline, stamina, composure, leadership, arrogance, humility, ...





and drugs, lots of drugs.

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All of the names there except for AB and Fish come when the draft didn't exist.

Kerna and Braddles with there reputations in SA, surely they would have been top 5 picks.

Why wouldnt a kid like Murphy have talent and all the rest of those things???Because he will go number 1???

And where do you a find a kid who has ALL those qualities if its not the number one draftee???

Pick 52???

The drugs bit we found on our rookie list a couple of years ago..

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but how do you measure those qualities?

as far as I can see dannyboy was simply making the point that a lot of these things cannot be measured at draft camp and because these intangibles that cannot be measured are part of what makes a champion footballer there is still that wonderful air of mystery to the game and that champions will still spring up from all sorts of places.

Synbad, you often mention these types of intangible qualities when referriing to players you like in the Recruitment Forum. I think you have emphasised that you have seen some of these qualities in Drum.

Surely they are a factor, and while intangibles such as those mentioned are a factor recruitment will never be a precise science, as many of those qualities cannot be measured as precisely as a beep test.

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Diesel, Hunter, Doull - these three would have been interesting in today's system. Sticks top 5. Braddles top 10. Motley top 10 (gee they were good gets!)

The point isn't about the No 1's. No one is saying that they will not be good. Rather that champions are often not the players everyone first sees them as. The point I was trying to make (poorly obviously) is that AB has deficiencies and therefore was not looked upon favourably - but is that the end of the story? I, for one, hope not.

Please try not to read anti-tanking stuff into everything. I wanted to find a way of saying AB (like Fisher) may be a surprise packet for the club. I try to be positive with the articles ('cept a couple as Molsey pointed out and guess what no one read those two).

I have a role to play on that website. I take it seriously. I call it doing my bit.

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This type of slight is alien in the more cultured part of the world - Walsh. Its up there with mad dogs, Englishmen and the midday sun!

Yeah and thats why i want a couple of picks. in fact if love 3 picks in the top 5 or 6.. so i can pick the eyes out of this draft and leave the others fighting over the carcass.

Thats why i dont want one pick alone at around 5.

Call me a greedy bastard... I am...

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Sticks Braddley Motley would have been one two and three with Platten coming in at four.
Doull???What makes you think in todays recruiting Doull wouldnt have gone early???

Im sure Fish and Bentick and a couple of others are good gets but you need more.. you need palmolive gold...

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There was no 'who ha about' Doully he was just a jacana kid coming to play. Ands he played a lot of reverves games before deemed ready (49?) But the thing was, once they played him they discovered one of those intangibles. Doully rarely got done. Put him on a bloke taller, or faster, or even stronger - somehow The doormat still won. But in today's draft would he be a standout - hmm small, too small for playing tall - fast, but not fast enough etc. He might have gone 1st round or could have gone pick 60 or even as a rookie. Thats the point.

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This type of slight is alien in the more cultured part of the world - Walsh. Its up there with mad dogs, Englishmen and the midday sun!

Thats the point there will always be the odd one or two that slip under the guard - thats why Pick Number 1 (in the Rookie Draft ) is vitally important as well.

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He would have gone early in todays talent identification dannyboy....
Lets not kid ourselves.
Theyre alittle smarter thses days and the pool they develop in is alittle more advanced and sophisticated.

Some of the blokes that played football in those days wouldnt even be playing today.... (John Nicholls is one).. too slow and too short .

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Or as he was described "the fat younger brother".

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"Hence you will not say that Greeks fight like heroes but that heroes fight like Greeks"?

Winston Churchill

so they would have failed to identify Nick's talent. And Doull we will not know you say they would have to suit your argument but that don't prove it. I have my doubts. I think there are blokes who can spot talent a mile off but then there are the clubs who lose sight of the 'intangibles' and take all the 'measurables' as the gospel. With Doull many would have gone ' but where will he play?'

You believe differently, fine but its a silly argument becuase we cannot base it on anything.

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This type of slight is alien in the more cultured part of the world - Walsh. Its up there with mad dogs, Englishmen and the midday sun!

dannyboy...youre taliking about a distant game
Doull was a modern day footballer. Nicholls wasnt.

If you dont believe me that Nicholls wouldnt not have made the modern game go ask his coach Ronald Dale Barrassi.. and one of the best if not the best rover Carlton ever produced.. Rod Ashman.. who said neither Nicholls or himelself would have made it.


I asked them myself (with someone else to settle a bet) and Bluegirldannielle was there as a witness....

Please dont go on and on with your ludicrous ramblings that pick 5 will be better than pick one and pick 3 or 4....

Life doesnt work like that!!!!............


I mean that might happen but then again you might even win tattslotto this weekend.. but its doubtful.

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'Please dont go on and on with your ludicrous ramblings that pick 5 will be better than pick one and pick 3 or 4....' where have I said that! See synbad this is where you come across as a jerk. You stick words in people's mouths because the argument gets tough.

You cannot prove anything except that this is your opinion - you're entitled to it but have no idea what i think because you actually do not read anything anyone else says escept as an except to bleat your own stuff.

As for Ashman saying that good on him, he's a modest bloke but he would have played today without a doubt. Nick would have too, without a doubt if he wanted it (that bit we'll never know). In my opinion. Thats it. that's all we are tlaking here. opinions. Not facts. In almost everything.

I try to respect yours. Try and do the same with mine and stop trying to stick words or opinions in my mouth. It belittles you.

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This type of slight is alien in the more cultured part of the world - Walsh. Its up there with mad dogs, Englishmen and the midday sun!

Thats belittling Dannyboy is when you talk utter crap and pretend you believe it.
If Ashman and Barrasi dont believe Nicholls could have played today he couldnt have even if you believe he could.
Syd Jackson said the same thing... but i have no witnesses to that one....

Yes it is my opinion only dannyboy .. that picks one and four will be better for the long term interests of this footy club than pick five alone...
And yes its your opion alone that says that pick five is better for Carlton than pick one and four or whatever we get....

But that just goes to prove what baloney you sprook.... but ill respect that you sprook baloney ok???

Just remember 20 years ago today we went out and took Kernahan Motley and Braddley (throw in Dora) the first 3 would have gone top 3 in a draft... and we won 2 premierships with them.....

and today we cant just go out and do the same thing but rely on the draft....!!!

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To be a champion you need talent and character. The wildcard when identifying U 18 players is how their talent will develop and adapt to AFL football and whether they have the character to develop the work ethic/rate necessary to mature.

Looking at this year's draft there's only four players that I'd consider to have the potential talent and character to develop into champions. Some others may say there are more players. Next year I'd say there would be nine players with the potential talent and character, and probably more as next year will show.

Recruiting is a thorough exercise, more so year after year. The idea of fairytale late picks is a decreasing possibility, the selection of lower age players who have less exposure and haven't been fully tested keep the fairytale late pick story alive. You could also consider players from non-traditional AFL states/backgrounds that have a larger development curve at the same age as kids from traditional AFL states/background, could fit into the fairytale late pick catogery. You also may consider that there is the 'late bloomer', someone who's talent develops at a later age.

Having said this, every player is in charge of their own destiny, judging how driven an individual would be in an AFL system, is a major factor which distinguishes the value of a recruiter.

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