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| Who has the pace at Carlton? http://talkingcarlton.com/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=8809 |
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| Author: | bondiblue [ Thu Mar 16, 2006 10:25 am ] |
| Post subject: | Who has the pace at Carlton? |
With the season only 18 days away before my beloved Blues run out on the field, I'm looking forward to improvement all over the ground this year; in our Backline, Midfield, Forwards, and Rucks. I can't wait for the first bounce of the ball, and watch the boys have a crack. IMO opinion the most important area on the field we need to step up to the next level is in the midfield. From where I stand, it is also the midfield group where I can see a lot of improvement coming from. Kouta and Stevens are already at the elite level, and blessed with pace and body strength to endure the rigours of elite football against the best the competition has to offer. But they need support. We also know that Lappin is also in the elite class to step in the middle, if we can afford that luxury. IMO most heartening improvement in the midfield has come from the kids in Bentick, Simpson, Carazzo, Betts and Houlihan who has stepped up (and only 24yo). Then we throw in Walker, Murphy, Russell (picks 1, 2 & 9 in the draft) who were born with the gift of class and pace, and we can see the potential for improvement. If they do rise beyond expectation the Baby Blues may morph into the New Mosquito Fleet. With improvement in the midfield we will increase our opportunity to get first use of the ball and attacking forward, whilst also reducing supply to the opposition's midfield. Hopefully, the result of the first use of the ball would see a reduction of the pressure on the backline from abundance of easy supply, as well as provide more opportunities in the forward line; which is looking exciting this year, and perhaps as good as any other team's forwardline. Before I start questioning each individual's ability in terms of their level of skill, experiences and stage of development, or where they are or are not in their development I need to to know if our players have the pace to keep abreast, or at the least keep up with , their opposition all over the field? I'm looking for a general assessment, because everyone can have a good and a bad day. Are our backmen fast enough to stay close to leading forwards, are our Forwards fast enough to create space and time, are our midfielders fast enough to run back and support the backmen or at least pressure their opponents' when making forward thrusts? I already know that we don't have athletic ruckmen like Jeff White or Josh Fraser. But who are our fastest big men. For example, I know that Prenders is a triathlete and has got a big engine, but this doesn't answer my question, is he fast? So do we have what it takes in terms of pace for 2006? It's OK to look at our team with rose coloured glasees; in fact it's healthy for our mental well being...and it's more fun. But I would like the help of TC, from those on the inside, or from those in the know, to help answer the following types of questions, as I would like to be have a better picture as to who has the pace for AFL footy (other than the PP time trials) at Carlton FC. The purpose of this exercise is to confirm the reason for my enthusiasm for the next 6 months (as a development year), or to bring some reality checks to my rose coloured views of the players on our list. Have our midfielders got the speed to keep up with the elite midfields? Which players are the fastest runners in the club, over 10, 20, 100 metres? Who are the fastest midfielders? Who are the fastest Backmen? Who are the fastest Backmen? I look forward to the evaluation, and hope my feelings are right. THE EMPIRE WILL STRIKE BACK!! as of this year I hope. |
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| Author: | SHHH! [ Thu Mar 16, 2006 11:30 am ] |
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Blind Optimism Must be lovely living in dreamland. Who is the fastest. Not us by the length of the straight. |
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| Author: | Electric Blue [ Thu Mar 16, 2006 11:36 am ] |
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SHHH! wrote: Blind Optimism
Must be lovely living in dreamland. Who is the fastest. Not us by the length of the straight. Jesus, dont get happy folks! 
Great to hear it through rose coloured glasses again, but I cant answer any of those questions, but I'll ask my Dad tonight after dinner. 
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| Author: | thehalford [ Thu Mar 16, 2006 11:38 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Who has the pace at Carlton? |
FFS SHHH!!! Take your own advice and stop being so @#$%&! negative. bondiblue wrote: With the season only 18 days away before my beloved Blues run out on the field,
18 days? Shit - that means I'm only 18 days away from turning 20! I better get the present I want... 
In all seriousness, most of our players aren't great in the 'express pace' stakes. Blokes like James Walker (GF Sprint winner 2 years in a row), Peter Burgoyne etc will run us off our feet. I daresay (note that this is an assessment from watching not many games recently) that Kade Simpson would be the fastest of our players, with blokes like Walker and Russell close behind. Will they lose this pace as they grow older? I hope not, because most of our 'elder' crew are rather more likely to be burnt off within 3 paces. |
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| Author: | jimmae [ Thu Mar 16, 2006 12:16 pm ] |
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You'll find their pace and endurance will continue to build (barring injury) until they're 29. And SHHH, the question was do we have the pace - let the discussion begin 
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| Author: | Carlton God [ Thu Mar 16, 2006 12:21 pm ] |
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Kouta isn't elite level, he's nothing more than a solid player lets be honest. He's only allowed to get away with his lazy non chasing ways because there are no other options. |
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| Author: | Elwood Blues1 [ Thu Mar 16, 2006 12:28 pm ] |
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Pace is a problem and i dont rate Nick Stevens quick either, Nick is smart but not super quick......I think the emphasis on the next draft will be on getting some quick smart ball carriers.....apart from Simpson, Walker, Carrazzo and Russell you get down to the out of favour Chambers and Bannister who are very fit and have pace but wont be playing much senior footy if at all judging by the preseason activities....we also lack a genuine express player like a Aaron Davey, Chris Judd, Andrew Lovett, Daniel Wells who can leave players standing and explode away from packs... I think you could have argued a case for Courtney Dempsey in last seasons draft..Dempsey is express and already has come under notice in practice games with his pace, not that I am unhappy with our draft picks but it would have been nice to get a quick player like Dempsey to add some balance but I guess you cant get everything in one draft.... Adelaide and Port got lucky with some what I call freebie players in Chris Knights and Danyl Pearce.....I'm a fan of Knights, quick smart and knows where the goals are and Pearce is another aboriginal lad with pace who managed a few games with success last season...getting lucky with some of these cheap players is half the battle of drafting....the Crows seem to make a habit of it. ie Rutten. I forget to mention Eddie Betts...Eddie needs to cement a spot this year and i'd like to see him have the odd run in the midfield and get his fitness up...he isnt super quick but he is a quick thinker... |
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| Author: | dannyboy [ Thu Mar 16, 2006 12:28 pm ] |
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now, now CG, you made him that way, so take the blame. |
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| Author: | Kouta [ Thu Mar 16, 2006 12:44 pm ] |
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Jake Edwards is as quick as Andrew Swallow who recorded a time of 2.92 seconds for 20 metres at the draft camp. But Livo was also the quickest at his draft camp and is still one of the quickest at the club over 20 metres. Pace is useless if they are slow to react to their opponent or as skilled as David Clarke! |
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| Author: | woof [ Thu Mar 16, 2006 1:54 pm ] |
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Electric Blue wrote: SHHH! wrote: Blind Optimism Must be lovely living in dreamland. Who is the fastest. Not us by the length of the straight. Jesus, dont get happy folks! Great to hear it through rose coloured glasses again, but I cant answer any of those questions, but I'll ask my Dad tonight after dinner. You would be better off asking the player that told you he won't be playing seniors this year. Surely he would have an opinion? |
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| Author: | slow_mo [ Thu Mar 16, 2006 3:54 pm ] |
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Bondi, don't let the negativity in here get to you. We're not all like that. In answer to your question, I don't think we lack pace at all. I think there are two main issues. The first is; you always look slow when you don't have the ball. The second issue is that you need your teammates to work hard off the ball in order to create space. Players like Judd are explosively quick, but his teammates also do a lot of blocking off the ball which allows him to find that inch of space he needs to break out of a pack. I think our boys need to focus more on working hard for each other. Once that is achieved the pace issue will take care of itself because we have plenty of players that can run the lines. |
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| Author: | Megaman [ Thu Mar 16, 2006 4:10 pm ] |
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slow_mo wrote: Bondi, don't let the negativity in here get to you. We're not all like that.
In answer to your question, I don't think we lack pace at all. I think there are two main issues. The first is; you always look slow when you don't have the ball. The second issue is that you need your teammates to work hard off the ball in order to create space. Players like Judd are explosively quick, but his teammates also do a lot of blocking off the ball which allows him to find that inch of space he needs to break out of a pack. I think our boys need to focus more on working hard for each other. Once that is achieved the pace issue will take care of itself because we have plenty of players that can run the lines. If anyones gonna know about pace it'll be slow_mo you'd think 
I think you're right though Slow, when we attempt a chase down we get blocked or put on our arse, when other teams chase us often more than one will make it through non-existent blocking to bring us down- lack of team work, sacrifice etc... |
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| Author: | bondiblue [ Thu Mar 16, 2006 5:16 pm ] |
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Having a laugh actually. It takes all sorts to create a laugh. Having a look in the mirror is the way I start my day. That's a laugh. I don't live in a dreamworld, but my life is a dream...if only you knew. Blind optimism SSHH says ...nah...just taking his advice on his post's that we're in for a bumpy ride. That means Wins and Losses. I'll enjoy the wins, and I'll live with the losses. Like myself SSHH has been spolied by the success of the CFC. He is funny at times, but he does seem to be very negative ; except when he re lives the past. Me, I like to live for the future, and all the shit that goes with barracking for a footy club, and as for the past, that's entertainment, good memories, history and bragging rights. Back to business... Thanks for the positive feedback halford, elwood, Juzz and slowmo It seems that we do have a problem with pace, we do not have any express runners, and where we do have pace it may not be complimented with footy smarts and fast reaction. All good stuff, with more tantalising stuff coming from Electric Blue. If you can't keep up with the pace of the game then you won't catch your opponent, let alone escape with the ball when you have it, unless you're as smart as Lance. We face Davey from the Demons Rnd 1 and we don't have express. Well gap no. 1 here we go...express...we've got to shut him down or count 5 goals now, and we must look at express pace when recruiting to counter the likes of Judd, Lovett etc. So who takes Davey, if we have no express man? Do we just write in the 5 goals now! No way, sure it's a gap in our make up right now (based on the other posters), but there is ways of shutting him down. So Far Thus far the fast are: Midfielders Simpson Walker Murphy Russell Carazzo Betts all the up and comers have got pace, that's great, and should be good support for Stevens and Kouta (best clearance player in the league...elite?...depends on your definition of elite...best does not mean solid IMO)...and good platform for a good midfield in the years to come...lets have a look at the others.... then there's Bannister (only 25) but has the goods to close down a fit Buckley. Who knows. If we are going to have a tagger, then this bloke is the one...not Walker Fast Defenders Livo (could turn the corner this year, and still young) Edwards (yet to prove himself) Forwards Fevola is fast enough lead for mine for a FF Setanta, Lappin, Waite and the Fish seem to have good pace. Am I wrong? I remember watching Fish last year in his comeback at training, and his pace really impressed me. Bring it on Electric Blue. THE EMPIRE WILL STRIKE BACK!! and Mr Cloudy Day will become positive again...unless all the kings men can't put him together again. |
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| Author: | showbag [ Thu Mar 16, 2006 5:55 pm ] |
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bondiblue wrote: We face Davey from the Demons Rnd 1 and we don't have express. Well gap no. 1 here we go...express...we've got to shut him down or count 5 goals now, and we must look at express pace when recruiting to counter the likes of Judd, Lovett etc.
So who takes Davey, if we have no express man? Do we just write in the 5 goals now! No way, sure it's a gap in our make up right now (based on the other posters), but there is ways of shutting him down. Carrazzo has had the better of Davey in their duels so far. I would continue to use him in this role against the De's. Robertson, Green and Bruce are the ones that kill us. Someone suggested Fisher on Robertson before as he is good in the air. Using the same thinking, I'd like to see how Longmuir plays in the backline. He is not slow, can play tall for his height and may match Robbo in the air - he wouldn't do worse than Teague last year anyways. Possibly a daft idea, but if we aren't going to use him as a small forward i'd like to see what he can offer our list. |
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| Author: | Synbad [ Thu Mar 16, 2006 10:12 pm ] |
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Id play Carazzo in thre midfield and Chambers doing a tag.... Carazzo finds the ball why waste that??? |
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| Author: | AGRO [ Thu Mar 16, 2006 10:31 pm ] |
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showbag wrote: Robertson, Green and Bruce are the ones that kill us.
Someone suggested Fisher on Robertson before as he is good in the air. . We need Fisher up forward - together with Waite & Fevola. Cant afford to waste Fisher on Robertson, although Robertson is one of those players who always seems to manage 5 or 6 goals against us. Walker would probably be the best match up on him, but I would like to see Walker run the lines from the wing rather than being wasted as a tagger. |
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| Author: | showbag [ Thu Mar 16, 2006 11:09 pm ] |
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Synbad wrote: Id play Carazzo in thre midfield and Chambers doing a tag....
Carazzo finds the ball why waste that??? I just don't think that Chambers is up to the job of looking after Davey. If Carrots can get Davey to tear another hammy, then we can release him into the midfield. win/win!! 
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| Author: | showbag [ Thu Mar 16, 2006 11:11 pm ] |
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AGRO wrote: showbag wrote: Robertson, Green and Bruce are the ones that kill us. Someone suggested Fisher on Robertson before as he is good in the air. . We need Fisher up forward - together with Waite & Fevola. Cant afford to waste Fisher on Robertson, although Robertson is one of those players who always seems to manage 5 or 6 goals against us. Walker would probably be the best match up on him, but I would like to see Walker run the lines from the wing rather than being wasted as a tagger. i wasn't agreeing that Fisher is the way to go on Robertson, i was suggesting that if we are thinking 'out of the box' then Longmuir may have some of the attributes that are needed ... he may not have some of the other attributes, but i'd like to see him get the chance to show what he can offer the side seeing as last year was a wasted one with him coming over to the Blues with an injury. |
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| Author: | BlueWorld [ Thu Mar 16, 2006 11:19 pm ] |
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showbag wrote: I just don't think that Chambers is up to the job of looking after Davey.
Played on Betts in the intra-club & didn't do too well against him. |
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| Author: | Ponkstar [ Fri Mar 17, 2006 1:07 am ] |
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It's interesting to note that Jordan Bannister represented us in the Grand Final sprint. Didn't go too well either... |
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