I was probably of the same opinion a couple of weeks ago, and if I'd let MMMs commentary sway me I'd say the same. However, after watching his efforts on Saturday on the biggest stage in this game I reckon I've swung into the believers camp.

Although I think he ultimately cost us the game being out there, he gained some great experience that will help his development. If he can overcome some of those small issues and be more comfortable out there, he has every chance to be there in another 3 years.

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Dukes,

How did he cost us the game by being out there?

Yes he may have stuffed up a kick for goal that could very well of won us the game, but we had our opportunities and we didn't take them.

I thought Setanta contributed a hell of a lot to our draw.

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Writer for SuperCoach Paige www.scpaige.com.au
Twitter - @johnfeeney24

That's "The Duke" PJ Not Dukes!! Remember the name, man !!

I'm not being critical, just stating the fact that a 6 gamer with his experience probably wouldn't normally be out there due to his inability to make logical decisions and be balanced in his skill when it counts.

I'm not saying he was an orphan when it comes to this, but if I was coaching for a place in the 8 I wouldn't have had Setanta on the field for the last Q. Not his fault, just fact.

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But that's it, we're not in a position where we are fighting for a spot in the 8.

We are sitting second last and are in a rebuilding process and when that occurs you are almost forced to play the kids and the unknowns to see what they have to offer.

Setanta was always going to be given ample game time this season to show Denis what he has to offer.

Saturday was a good day to play Setanta because a) it was Essendon* vs Carlton at the MCG and b) the pressure was right on. Perfect opportunity to see how Setanta would handle the pressure of all that.

For mine, he handled it very well and deserved to be out there.

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Writer for SuperCoach Paige www.scpaige.com.au
Twitter - @johnfeeney24

I totally agree with you, he deserves to be out there given his efforts of the last 3 years. And yes, I agree as I said earlier he did very well. But all I was saying was that if we had a team capable of playing finals he probably wouldn't have been there at that moment because some of his decisions and skills wouldn't have stood up to the pressure.

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Firstly, I think the age is misleading. Should be judged on how long he has been on the list - ie first year - secondly with regards the above comment I have 4 words for you Sporn, Livo, Prenda, Davies...how long, how good. I don't know if you were there SB but if you were then you can't have been watching. He flogged Lee and Reynolds, won about 8 one on one contests and showed enormous promise. Are you going to delist Russell for being outmarked by Monfires in the square in the last quarter? The reason you might recruit from Irleand is because you might get a TAdgh Kennelly. Thye reason the O'h's are on the list is because they have amazing athleticism. Which you are not going to find in any league around Australia. Having recruited them any reasonable supporetr would have given them 4-5 years which will coincide with the rest of the team coming good. How many years have we given Livo and Sporn and where are they in relation to SO'h.

You can add Chris Grant to that list. He towelled him up in a 1 on 1 last week too .

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Oh goodie...Tweedle-dee joins the party...

Did you even read the half a dozen posts before you blurted out your usual uninformed drivel?

IT WAS SURREY WHO STARTED THE CRAP ABOUT FACTS!

Danny and I were bemoaning the inability of those who can't distinguish the difference between a fact and an opinion and now I find myself bemoaning the inability of you to comprehend basic sentences.



As for Setanta, do you honestly think a guy coming from where he has over three years and showing what he has over the last few weeks wouldn't be snapped up by another team if he were in this year's draft?

The Bulldogs took Tom Williams with pick number 6 a couple of years back even though he'd barely played AFL because he showed some of the agility and athleticism that Setanta has in spades.

Setanta had 15 touches and 6 tackles last weekend and is miles ahead of Williams and you're complaining that we shouldn't have picked him up?

And we picked him up for nothing!

Is he making mistakes? Yes - like every other player in the league (and especially those on our list). Those mistakes will lessen over time and we'll have a nearly 2m monster (with a color-coded brother!) who runs like the wind, leaps like a high jumper and has the attitude of a champion.

Sydney - you make Surrey look smart...




Speak for yourself...

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“When a clown moves into a palace, he doesn't become a king. The palace turns into a circus.”
Turkish Proverb

Your opinion again thats the problem GWS and thats why you currently have 3 Carlton forums , because people like yourself take things all to seriously and rate your opinion higher than anyone elses . People like Surrey and myself and others try to voice their opinion and get attacked by posters who are full of themselves like your good self because it doesn't agree with your line of thinking

And show me one of your post that wasn't opinionated

We are sitting here talking about Football GWS - Remember that we are not in the Head Debating team down at the local university

As for Setanta we will see but remember Beasy cost us nothing and wasn't afforded the time that Sentanta has . And Williams is 19 Setanta is 22 and will be 23 before the start of next year there is a difference .

and no I dont think Setanta would have been snapped up by any other club

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If you allow the Government to change the Laws in an emergency
They will create an Emergency to change the Laws

It's SETANTA

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"You are being watched. The government has a secret system. A machine that spies on you every hour of every day. I know because I built it." - Finch

Sorry fixed it

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If you allow the Government to change the Laws in an emergency
They will create an Emergency to change the Laws

[/quote]and no I dont think Setanta would have been snapped up by any other club[/quote]

Do you not, what about the fact Collingwood tried to get him 2 or 3 years before the blues did.

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'Cause I'm J.U.D.D
I'm dynamite
J.U.D.D
And I'll win that fight
J.U.D.D
I'm a power load
J.U.D.D, Watch me explode

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There's so much I could say...

whoooosh,

Do you deliberately mean to miss the point time after time?

The point was not about having a different opinion.

The point is that it is stupid to represent your opinion as fact.

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and no I dont think Setanta would have been snapped up by any other club[/quote]

Do you not, what about the fact Collingwood tried to get him 2 or 3 years before the blues did.[/quote]

I find that interesting because usually what Eddie wants Eddie gets .

Were they trying to get him as an international rookie or as a drafted player ???? And why did he not go to them?????

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If you allow the Government to change the Laws in an emergency
They will create an Emergency to change the Laws

No but who for god sake states anything on here as facts its all opinion and that what my post was about .

So who is missing the point

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If you allow the Government to change the Laws in an emergency
They will create an Emergency to change the Laws

I still fail to see how some people perceive what I said as not true.

Have Carlton improved over the last 4 years?
Have we not been belted for our biggest hidings ever under Pagan in 100 years of history?
Has Pagan not tried to adjust his game plan this year instead of 3 years ago?
Have we not lost many experienced players in the last 3 years, some for nothing?

Am I missing something or do we just live in a bubble!

You are missing the point.

Surrey represented his opinion as fact.

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I haven't got a problem with Sydney's view of Setanta. I can agree to differ with him, and I can't see much that is illogical in Surreys comment

It doesn't mean I think DP is hopeless but I also don't reckon he has been great. Surrey makes some good points, and yes we don't know that anyone would have done any better, but surely we can make a judgement from the facts at hand. Like some of those Surrey points out above. Maybe the problem is that a few of us are arguing on personalities rather than opinions. And no, an opinion is not a fact, but you can seek to prove the worth of your opinions by bringing in facts like win/loss ratio/ record thumpings/ draft penalties etc.

Excellent points, GWS.