Thanks for enlightening me, Sir George, an ego with a keyboard.

Glad you feel so comfortable with your inflated sense of self worth, it makes us ignorant's lives so much better.

You are a wonderful man....Sir!

I'm OK with it if you are...

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NOW YOU'RE JUST SOME CLUB THAT I USED TO KNOW.

Sorry Verbs, George, whose is bigger?

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What if everything is an illusion and nothing exists? In that case, I definitely overpaid for my carpet
Woody Allen

verbs , do you think each player at the club is busting a gut out there each week?
Did you watch the collingwood game last night?
do you think our boys are going at it with the sam intensity as say.............. BUCKLEY????????

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Due to recent budget cuts and the rising cost of electricity, gas, and oil....... the Light at the End of the Tunnel has been turned off. We apologize for the inconvenience.

Buckley was magnificent last night...a true captain and leader...I hope our leadership group were watching

All you want from your leaders who are getting paid a packet is to "set the tone".. Every club has those except us...

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Due to recent budget cuts and the rising cost of electricity, gas, and oil....... the Light at the End of the Tunnel has been turned off. We apologize for the inconvenience.

ours are tone deaf

WTF???

Being a long-time member of TBV and now TC, I've come to respect the opinions of a few people on these sites. George Harris is one, Synbad is another, as are BlueMark, Cazzesman (and his wife) and frank dardew. There are more, but each time these guys speak up about serious issues it seems to me they are more often on the mark. Sometimes they differ in their views but the underlying message often rings true.

I don't think Synbad et al are doomsdayers because when Carlton looked like they might turn the corner in the pre-season they were on board with it and not shooting it down.

So when they're now all talking about big problems in Paganland i believe it's time to sit up and listen.

That's just my opinion and everyone is within their right to disagree with me. I don't pretend to know anything about what's going on apart from what i observe on the field, so I'm glad there are people who are willing to share information from behind the scenes.

I only wish they'd actually name some names, but that may compromise their own standing.

George, I am also frustrated beyond belief, feel like it's been three years (since spoon one) completely wasted.
I think the media, would see this internal mutiny as an excuse, or an inevitable consequence of the poor performances. Seems during the Wizz all was well.
The question of character of the individuals at the club is well trodden on this track and just to give my summary:
We have the poisioned minds of the Parkin/Brittian "do it your way" crew and the new "nutcases" drafted late because of question marks over them, and the "disgarded crew" already frail on confidence after previous failure, and the others lacking in natural talent who have just had enough and don't see respect from teammates coaches, President, MC and supporters to ever push hard enough to get there.
Leadership on the field is non existent, Lance, Kouta, Campo nice guys shit leaders and Kouta aside both others have seen the game change and they not adapt ecept in their bank accounts.
Lets hope we seriously look at attracting professionals in the draft.
No more lovable rogues who can kick a bag of goals and eat their weight in junk food and beer, the early eighties are over last I checked the trophy cabinet.
For me at Carlton, players, coaches, and the board still live in the past and frankly considering the future who can blame us.

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Green Shooter

Plenty of talk on this board now about Pagan losing the players, or the players just not wishing to "play ball" so to speak.

With it now almost being a fact, how will you feel and how hard will you be barracking at the next match you attend?

Harder than our players are competing for the ball perhaps?

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NOW YOU'RE JUST SOME CLUB THAT I USED TO KNOW.

I am first to admit that I am on the outside of the outside here. And I do respect George's opinion.

But what evidence is there of this player contempt? And this "sanctioned tanking"?

From my perspective, you are simply shit. And the main reason you are shit is because Elliot/Parkin/O'Sullivan right royally [REDACTED] your list in the late 90s. Recovery has been compounded by the cruel draft penalties. But the real problem is that you have no decent Carlton-grown 23-28 yolds at all.

Kouta, Lance and Campo have never been bang-crash leaders, it is ridiculous to expect them to change their style this late. The problem here also is sheeted home to the late 90s when a new generation of leaders was not sought. It's not the current leardership groups fault, they were never equipped for the job in the first place. I agree this means you should get rid of them if you can.

Pagan is a good coach who only has a plan A and that plan relies on exactly the type of players you do not have -- Carey, Stevens, Archer, King. Again a legacy of your previous incompetent regime.

Look I understand it is hard for Carlton supporters to understand this and simpler to look for a conspiracy theory. But you are paying for past sins and Occam's razor says you are SHIT!

It's going to be a long hard road back, taken one painful season at a time. I do agree generally with Synbad's view.

As a Melbourne supporter of a certain age I find a certain sense of deja vu when I see the "it can't be happening here -- we are Carlton!" attitude. You bet your bottom dollar it is!

Barracking for the individual George. That's it...

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Galaxies in the grain...

What is an "almost fact"? Does that mean if a rumour is posted enough times and discussed it becomes fact??

Is that different to being simply shit every second year.

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"Hence you will not say that Greeks fight like heroes but that heroes fight like Greeks"?

Winston Churchill

agree with most of what you say....except the last bit...it wont take all that long....because we have Dennis and you dont

bu then again...carlton fans...lets hope it doesnt take us 45 years to rebuild like our friend from demonland here ay??

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R A D I C A L B R O T H E R S

Inspired by the One-Minute Sculptures of Erwin Wurm

"All in all is all we are..."

lets use houlas and lances payements on luke power.look good in a blue jumper

shit every second year may end up being a necessary strategy for all clubs....

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“Every single element of the Club has to be the best in the league, meticulously and methodically, and only by doing this will we be elite and challenge for number 17.”
Greg Lee

I am living in the UK at the moment, and have seen 2 quarters of football this year (guess ). So I haven't seen any of the recent performances, although I have read the media articles.

I accept that you guys have more of an idea than me, being in Melbourne and maybe having sources at the club. I still find it contradictory that players whose position is marginal would decide not to put in at all. Surely if they didn't want to be playing for Springvale next year, fear of your future would just make you put in more? Even if Pagan had given you the word that you're gone at season's end, wouldn't you want to attract the eye of other clubs? I'm not saying that it's impossible, but I don't see the logic.

May ol 55 is right after all...

George Harris wrote:

As one of the are you waiting for an answer from me George? Or are you going to enlighten me further with your "next move" ? Almost four days since your initial hand grenade & I'm now asking myself "what was the point?"