i actually am not thinking grand finals redback....

this club has been so poorly managed for so long its not funny.....

we are not in a very , very good position....

we dont even have a proper midfield....

mick is here for the next 5 years .. health is the only reason he wont be.

strap yourself in and enjoy the ride.

should leave us in a better state than he found us....

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whats a proper midfield?

I'm beginning to think that last sentence will amount to a very small mercy. A "should" has crept in to where it would never have been before.

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Just because I'm offended, doesn't mean I'm wrong.

it's sad to see that your standards have dropped ever since Ratten was dismissed.

funny thing is ratten also left us in a healthier state than he found us

not made up of old codgers.... guys that dont run two ways and apply pressure.. guys that dont kick goals from the midfield... guys that cant hit targets or cant take a mark under pressure...guys that cant tackle.. and guys that cant create... guys who dont have good decision making skills.

That is not a midfield..its a "midfield".. but its not a MIDFIELD thats going to carry you anywhere....

nd we dont have too many midfielders that can do half of those things..... so theyre not finals worthy going forwards.

ust check out the better sides.....

our mids overall cant kick goals ...
they cant run back and forwrd... so defensive ones cant create.. creative ones dont defend(spreading too)
their skills are average
cant mark under pressure or kick under pressure...
contest
speed

Work through our midfielders with those things in mind and tell me who does half...

Then colectively as a midfield its very poor.... going forward....

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no he didnt.. he had the team at a more mature stage than he found it.. and added the then number 1 player in the league..
He proceeded to run that young list into the ground....

He left us outside of the eight.... thats why he was sacked!!!!...

and he managed with so many early picks to win one eliminational final...

Quite a feat... considering all the picks in the top dozen he had...
He accumulated superflous types....

Like that word "superfluous"?.... u have a list of 42 and this is what were left with.

How did he manage to leave us in a better position than he got us?
We were last and had a number of number 1 picks... and Judd... plus Fev...

No mean effort...

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Yes he did

from last to 10th

Three out of five year in the finals(I suppose you didn't enjoy those years?)

Three maturing #1 picks ...plus Judd...plus Henderson...

plus the types that made the finals this year under tricky micky

I'd say that's better off

Yeah its funny when you inherit 3 number 1s + Judd + a Coleman medallist at his peak + Pratt's arrival and take us from bottom 4 (hardly any more further down we could have gone) to 1 final's win in 5 years.
Robert Walls couldn't get 4 years at Carlton with a flag and runner up under his belt

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If I want your opinion, I'll give it to you!

If they mature anymore they might be in danger of driving though shop windows...

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“I would rather have questions that can't be answered than answers that can't be questioned.” ― Richard Feynman

Mick will get new players in too. Can we bring that up when he is gone and we are judging whether he left us better than he arrived ?? Silly logic.

Before Ratts came we were playing the long kicking game to contests that we were outnumbered in. Throwing away hard earned possession of the ball.
Ratts took us away from that. Got our clearances up ,contested ball numbers up, tackling numbers up and had us holding on the ball a lot more than the dated plan we were using under Pagan.

Ratts left us in a much better state than when he took over.

no he didnt... we were last 3 number 1 picks and a few early ones and chris judd

last to tenth in over 5 years isnt a feat

thats what you want when you are average

Now mick took Collingwood from last to second and gave them a flag and a few grand finals and was a prelim stalwart
What kind of a rise is last to tenth with all those early picks???

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id argue we were in a good state when he came in... we were primed.. and he led us to one eliminational final win.. and a broken list of hbfers who he didnt even like but gave them contract extensions

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You can laugh as much as you like but his list has been a consistent finals contender for much of his career and MM's first one which he had no say in compiling.

That's better off

so you can hate him all you like but the facts cannot be swayed because of your personal emotions


Now let’s see if your million dollar coach can take a lower end finals team to the higher end next year like Lyon has with a bunch of misfits (apparently what we are described as by the MM supporters such as yourself) or isn't he that good?

his unprecedented number of picks in the top dozen.. and one eiminational final win?
its why he will never ever get another senior coaching gig again...
A galaxy of ealry picks.. go through the list.... read and believe!!!

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..i think it's less about ladder position, which can rise and fall, and ought to rise from bottom as we were.. ....and more about the playing list.. ..we have too many mentally weak, soft competitors.. ..we lack real leadership and non-stop effort and G&D.. ..without any of this, we were never going to crack the top 4.. ..without cracking the top 4, it's just fun wins but no real oomph..

edit - will clarify, less about ladder position, when said position is below top 4

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..if you can't be good, be good at it..

id argue Mick took over Collingwood when they were primed to be just as silly.

Id argue if mick he got sacked in 2005 he would have left them in a worse state to be even more stupid.

Seems a strange argument that a coach only achieved anything because he had good players

Enough with the MM bashing ant he Ratts defending.
Ratts underachieved big time with what he had at his disposal.
He had a young hungry list + Judd and Fev at the peak of their powers, and we got nothing in return...
- Had a young enthusiastic list ready to be chiseled into competitive finals footy winning beasts (ala Hinkley at Port and Lyon at Freo), but instead he chose to turn them into soft outside running nancies.
- Spent the first two years of his appointment with a 'kick it to Fev' game plan, and when Fev imploded and was traded, it was 'give it to the champ (Judd)' time.
- Couldn't control Fev
- Overworked Judd into the ground
- Walks was on the trade table at one stage too.
- Turned a kid we drafted as a the best young mid in the country (Gibbs) into a soft Half Back Flanker
- Disastrous recruiting and development under his tenure

I can go on....

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James Hird and Essendon* FC - #FOREVERDRUGCHEATS

Hear hear!
Make the bullshit stop.

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dane's trolling again

The argument is whether Carlton was better when Ratts left than when he arrived.

The Ratten/Judd years will forever be known as our 'Lost Years'

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James Hird and Essendon* FC - #FOREVERDRUGCHEATS