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 Post subject: Re: List Management 2014
PostPosted: Wed Sep 03, 2014 3:44 pm 
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Rod Ashman

Joined: Tue Mar 01, 2005 9:35 am
Posts: 2125
Amazing how players who are not getting much of an offer from their original club (who know them best) suddenly become great because they are available. Higgins is a skillful, injury prone under achiever. What does he add? Is it better that he be played on a hbf ahead of Sheehan? Just because he is available doesn't mean we either need or want him. We don't get him for nothing, we pay $350k or so for him and he sits on our list. I'd rather draft an extra 18 year old, pay him the base wage and spend the balance of the $350k on development. We are so mediocre. i don't want a club that moves up from 13th to 9th and back for a decade. look at the Hawks and their ten year strategy from when Clarkson arrived. They bit the bullet, had a clear strategy they followed which gave them pain for a few years and turned them into a powerhouse. They didn't top up until they were around the premiership mark. Stars come out of the draft, we have to be the best at identifying them and developing them, instead of wasting picks and then sniffing around other mediocre clubs for their mediocre discards.


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 Post subject: Re: List Management 2014
PostPosted: Wed Sep 03, 2014 4:01 pm 
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Geoff Southby
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Joined: Sat Jan 20, 2007 2:57 pm
Posts: 5338
Location: Melbourne
Still offers a lot more then many regulars in our starting 22, with a much bigger upside.

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 Post subject: Re: List Management 2014
PostPosted: Wed Sep 03, 2014 4:50 pm 
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Horrie Clover

Joined: Mon Feb 28, 2005 3:10 pm
Posts: 322
Location: Melbourne, Victoria
Id rather play Higgins then Sheehan, sheehan while has alot of upside, is miles away from AFL level. He needs time to develop in the reserves. Higgins will actually help us make

Playing a bunch of guys who are young and expecting them to then win a premiership in 5 years is nonsense. I dont think its happened for any sides. Also the hawks bottomed out for possibly 1 or 2 years and then moved up and developed their young talent and then topped up with good experienced players. We already bottomed out for 4 years and we still didnt get anywhere, instead of building a side of 18 year olds with no direction we should have developed them in the reserves and played senior players.
Everyones happy to wait another 5 years to maybe and its a big maybe, have the perfect 22. We have a half decent side on the improve so we should be bringing in players who can help us make finals, can higgins help us make finals, 100% and at 26 will do so for a few years.


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 Post subject: Re: List Management 2014
PostPosted: Wed Sep 03, 2014 5:01 pm 
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Rod Ashman
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Joined: Fri Dec 29, 2006 2:54 pm
Posts: 2521
Navy Blue Horse wrote:

OK, so now break down the over 25's into say 25-28 and 29+. That might tell a tale.


25-28 - 29+

Sydney: 12-9
Hawks: 13-7
Cats: 6-9
Freo: 13-7
Port: 10-4
Blues: 16-5

Further shows that we're fairly loaded with guys who should be in their absolute prime, more than twice as many as the cats, but our team is still mediocre. A fair sign that our players in this age bracket simply aren't very good and need to be turned over. The problem we've had is that with a high % of draft busts we've been constantly turning over 21yr olds for 18yr olds, while mediocre 25yr olds keep hanging on season after season.

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PostPosted: Wed Sep 03, 2014 5:02 pm 
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formerly BlueRob
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Joined: Mon Sep 19, 2005 12:45 pm
Posts: 3073
Punter22 wrote:
Sydney Blue wrote:
Barone wrote:
Its evident there was a huge shift in the team mentality half way through the year, i think they have stopped waiting for things to happen and actually got off their backside and made it happen, and this is where players like robbo and gartlett , who unfortunetly arnt on the same page, dont fit in.

unfortunetly the issues i beleive they cant fit into the new model, are very politically incorrect so i wont say them, but i honestly beleive it's why they cant fit in with the change of mind.

Rounds 1-11 4 wins 7 losses
Rounds 12-24 3 wins 1 draw and 7 losses

Can someone run it by ne again how we improved in the back half of the year


Do you watch the games? Serious question, based on that post.


We might have improved ... lets say we have. The problem is other teams have improved more.

If it were any other coach but Madhouse we would be slamming them because of the ladder position.

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 Post subject: Re: List Management 2014
PostPosted: Wed Sep 03, 2014 5:05 pm 
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formerly BlueRob
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Joined: Mon Sep 19, 2005 12:45 pm
Posts: 3073
Typical double standards we have come to know and love. We hire Trigg and trade Robinson.

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PostPosted: Wed Sep 03, 2014 5:59 pm 
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Alex Jesaulenko

Joined: Sat May 14, 2005 2:15 pm
Posts: 21646
Location: North of the border
Punter22 wrote:
Sydney Blue wrote:
Barone wrote:
Its evident there was a huge shift in the team mentality half way through the year, i think they have stopped waiting for things to happen and actually got off their backside and made it happen, and this is where players like robbo and gartlett , who unfortunetly arnt on the same page, dont fit in.

unfortunetly the issues i beleive they cant fit into the new model, are very politically incorrect so i wont say them, but i honestly beleive it's why they cant fit in with the change of mind.

Rounds 1-11 4 wins 7 losses
Rounds 12-24 3 wins 1 draw and 7 losses

Can someone run it by ne again how we improved in the back half of the year


Do you watch the games? Serious question, based on that post.

Watch about 4-5 games each week and I can tell you the so called improvement in the 2nd half of the year was a pile shite.
We played seriously undermanned hawks and cats and because we got close everyone was saying we had improved.
If there was a difference it was one factor alone
C.Judd
Seriously think at times you have to leave the bubble and look at it from the outside to see the total picture.
Football is about wins and losses .Not individual improvements or hard fought brave efforts.
And the second half of the season almost mirrors the first in results for and against.
So don't give me that bull we improved.
Watch and see when we are 0 and 3 or 4 next year with season wiped out in a month and Malthouse telling you it is process not wins and losses that count.

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PostPosted: Wed Sep 03, 2014 5:59 pm 
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Alex Jesaulenko

Joined: Sat May 14, 2005 2:15 pm
Posts: 21646
Location: North of the border
Punter22 wrote:
Sydney Blue wrote:
Barone wrote:
Its evident there was a huge shift in the team mentality half way through the year, i think they have stopped waiting for things to happen and actually got off their backside and made it happen, and this is where players like robbo and gartlett , who unfortunetly arnt on the same page, dont fit in.

unfortunetly the issues i beleive they cant fit into the new model, are very politically incorrect so i wont say them, but i honestly beleive it's why they cant fit in with the change of mind.

Rounds 1-11 4 wins 7 losses
Rounds 12-24 3 wins 1 draw and 7 losses

Can someone run it by ne again how we improved in the back half of the year


Do you watch the games? Serious question, based on that post.

Watch about 4-5 games each week and I can tell you the so called improvement in the 2nd half of the year was a pile shite.
We played seriously undermanned hawks and cats and because we got close everyone was saying we had improved.
If there was a difference it was one factor alone
C.Judd
Seriously think at times you have to leave the bubble and look at it from the outside to see the total picture.
Football is about wins and losses .Not individual improvements or hard fought brave efforts.
And the second half of the season almost mirrors the first in results for and against.
So don't give me that bull we improved.
Watch and see when we are 0 and 3 or 4 next year with season wiped out in a month and Malthouse telling you it is process not wins and losses that count.

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They will create an Emergency to change the Laws


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 Post subject: Re: List Management 2014
PostPosted: Wed Sep 03, 2014 6:04 pm 
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Craig Bradley

Joined: Sun Nov 18, 2012 3:29 pm
Posts: 7074
Seems like only our opposition are only to be undermanned and have injuries.


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 Post subject: Re: List Management 2014
PostPosted: Wed Sep 03, 2014 7:11 pm 
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Bert Deacon

Joined: Sun Jan 22, 2012 8:14 am
Posts: 577
If we lose Casboult & Waite this preseason it's a massive step backwards. 3yrs of work into Casboult and a rival club will reap the rewards. Our A Graders sign on and our B Graders, potential A's look else where. Did we over pay the top teir leaving nothing?
I will be very disheartened if we go into Rnd1 with Kreuzer, Hendo & Watson as our key targets for the 2015 season.


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 Post subject: Re: List Management 2014
PostPosted: Wed Sep 03, 2014 7:11 pm 
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Bert Deacon

Joined: Sun Jan 22, 2012 8:14 am
Posts: 577
If we lose Casboult & Waite this preseason it's a massive step backwards. 3yrs of work into Casboult and a rival club will reap the rewards. Our A Graders sign on and our B Graders, potential A's look else where. Did we over pay the top teir leaving nothing?
I will be very disheartened if we go into Rnd1 with Kreuzer, Hendo & Watson as our key targets for the 2015 season.


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 Post subject: Re: List Management 2014
PostPosted: Wed Sep 03, 2014 7:27 pm 
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Stephen Kernahan
User avatar

Joined: Mon Feb 28, 2005 2:39 pm
Posts: 15848
cecil89 wrote:
Navy Blue Horse wrote:

OK, so now break down the over 25's into say 25-28 and 29+. That might tell a tale.


25-28 - 29+

Sydney: 12-9
Hawks: 13-7
Cats: 6-9
Freo: 13-7
Port: 10-4
Blues: 16-5

Further shows that we're fairly loaded with guys who should be in their absolute prime, more than twice as many as the cats, but our team is still mediocre. A fair sign that our players in this age bracket simply aren't very good and need to be turned over. The problem we've had is that with a high % of draft busts we've been constantly turning over 21yr olds for 18yr olds, while mediocre 25yr olds keep hanging on season after season.



That surprises me, thought we'd be more 50/50 in those age brackets. Well done.

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 Post subject: Re: List Management 2014
PostPosted: Wed Sep 03, 2014 7:56 pm 
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Ken Hunter

Joined: Wed Feb 01, 2006 6:54 pm
Posts: 14686
Location: The Vodka Train
Hibbo wrote:
If we lose Casboult & Waite this preseason it's a massive step backwards. 3yrs of work into Casboult and a rival club will reap the rewards. Our A Graders sign on and our B Graders, potential A's look else where. Did we over pay the top teir leaving nothing?
I will be very disheartened if we go into Rnd1 with Kreuzer, Hendo & Watson as our key targets for the 2015 season.


..krooz will be main ruck, hendo will do the heavy lifting as the key forward.. ..we may add t our key stocks over off season, Waite can go, bolt isn't worth what the market offers..

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 Post subject: List Management 2014
PostPosted: Wed Sep 03, 2014 8:05 pm 
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Alex Jesaulenko
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Joined: Tue Mar 08, 2005 10:14 am
Posts: 22357
Casboult is a potential A?

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dane's trolling again


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PostPosted: Wed Sep 03, 2014 8:37 pm 
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Mike Fitzpatrick
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Joined: Tue Jul 03, 2007 7:03 pm
Posts: 4251
Location: Around the Corner
Sydney Blue wrote:
Punter22 wrote:
Sydney Blue wrote:
Barone wrote:
Its evident there was a huge shift in the team mentality half way through the year, i think they have stopped waiting for things to happen and actually got off their backside and made it happen, and this is where players like robbo and gartlett , who unfortunetly arnt on the same page, dont fit in.

unfortunetly the issues i beleive they cant fit into the new model, are very politically incorrect so i wont say them, but i honestly beleive it's why they cant fit in with the change of mind.

Rounds 1-11 4 wins 7 losses
Rounds 12-24 3 wins 1 draw and 7 losses

Can someone run it by ne again how we improved in the back half of the year


Do you watch the games? Serious question, based on that post.

Watch about 4-5 games each week and I can tell you the so called improvement in the 2nd half of the year was a pile shite.
We played seriously undermanned hawks and cats and because we got close everyone was saying we had improved.
If there was a difference it was one factor alone
C.Judd
Seriously think at times you have to leave the bubble and look at it from the outside to see the total picture.
Football is about wins and losses .Not individual improvements or hard fought brave efforts.
And the second half of the season almost mirrors the first in results for and against.
So don't give me that bull we improved.
Watch and see when we are 0 and 3 or 4 next year with season wiped out in a month and Malthouse telling you it is process not wins and losses that count.


You don't think the latter two might lead to the former? I'm amazed you didn't see a more committed and organised effort in the back half of the season, but there you go.


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PostPosted: Wed Sep 03, 2014 9:08 pm 
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Rod Ashman

Joined: Sat Jul 30, 2011 10:17 pm
Posts: 2079
Punter22 wrote:
Sydney Blue wrote:
Punter22 wrote:
Sydney Blue wrote:
Barone wrote:
Its evident there was a huge shift in the team mentality half way through the year, i think they have stopped waiting for things to happen and actually got off their backside and made it happen, and this is where players like robbo and gartlett , who unfortunetly arnt on the same page, dont fit in.

unfortunetly the issues i beleive they cant fit into the new model, are very politically incorrect so i wont say them, but i honestly beleive it's why they cant fit in with the change of mind.

Rounds 1-11 4 wins 7 losses
Rounds 12-24 3 wins 1 draw and 7 losses

Can someone run it by ne again how we improved in the back half of the year


Do you watch the games? Serious question, based on that post.

Watch about 4-5 games each week and I can tell you the so called improvement in the 2nd half of the year was a pile shite.
We played seriously undermanned hawks and cats and because we got close everyone was saying we had improved.
If there was a difference it was one factor alone
C.Judd
Seriously think at times you have to leave the bubble and look at it from the outside to see the total picture.
Football is about wins and losses .Not individual improvements or hard fought brave efforts.
And the second half of the season almost mirrors the first in results for and against.
So don't give me that bull we improved.
Watch and see when we are 0 and 3 or 4 next year with season wiped out in a month and Malthouse telling you it is process not wins and losses that count.


You don't think the latter two might lead to the former? I'm amazed you didn't see a more committed and organised effort in the back half of the season, but there you go.


no doubt we looked better in the second half of the year

however, I wouldn't get too excited as we still didn't win many games

until this team can string together a number of wins we are still in no man's land

this club has been teasing us for too many years for our expectations to be high

remember it's been 14 years since we finished in the top four

I'm over the brave losses and commendable efforts


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 Post subject: Re: List Management 2014
PostPosted: Wed Sep 03, 2014 10:13 pm 
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Bruce Comben

Joined: Thu Aug 27, 2009 9:48 am
Posts: 22
BigBlueWave wrote:
Typical double standards we have come to know and love. We hire Trigg and trade Robinson.


Really? Not really.... Really.

General chat says the club was very clear with Mitch that he was on his last strike. If so his lie was a bit of a nothing to lose strategy. Tell the truth and he's out. Try to lie and worst case scenario is he's out, or with luck he gets away with it. Nothing to lose really.

However I digress. The point is there is probably a decent reason to move him on (above or other) and for me to change the user name I took after his first game where his passion alone won me.

Does that really mean employing Trigg is a double standard? Not in my opinion but I can see why you think so.

Also explains why Jeff MIGHT survive if he wasn't in the same last strike warning scenario. Let's hope he's next years Yazz style feel good story.


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 Post subject: Re: List Management 2014
PostPosted: Wed Sep 03, 2014 10:17 pm 
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Bruce Comben

Joined: Thu Aug 27, 2009 9:48 am
Posts: 22
And above all else, let's hope we hold on to Bolt!


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 Post subject: Re: List Management 2014
PostPosted: Wed Sep 03, 2014 10:45 pm 
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Stephen Silvagni

Joined: Thu Feb 02, 2006 11:03 am
Posts: 25623
Location: Bondi Beach
dane wrote:
Casboult is a potential A?


That's what youve got to ask.

Plenty of opinions.
I think he is what he is for the next 5 years.
He'll be a good mark and teams will pay him more respect.
He'll always be an inconsistent kick.

I say that with a lot at stake. He's young.
He might have one 25 goal breakout year.
He couldnt be more that that.

Could he??
...round again....

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 Post subject: List Management 2014
PostPosted: Wed Sep 03, 2014 10:46 pm 
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Alex Jesaulenko
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Joined: Tue Mar 08, 2005 10:14 am
Posts: 22357
Based on that. Trade table.

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