If Kouta's 2006 is the same as 2005 he should retire.

Id have somebody who will be at the club beyond next year.
Look were rebuilding.. were rebuilding our team, our structure, our culture... so why have a guy thats captain only for a year during this?
We might as well rebuild our leadership stakes.

Id make Stevens captain.. and id have a host of deputies and turn leadership into a common responsibilty across the board.

Our team of kids need to understand responsibility and the meaning of leadership asap... Now is as good a time as ever to take it away from a player that has been a dominant name around the club and pass it on to the many who will be carrying the torch forward for years to come.

Leadership has been non existant at Carlton since Sticks.. and certainly since SOS retured.

We just cant keep going on like this because Kouta has been at the club longest.

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No 1 or No 2 in the AFL for contested possession in 2005. Yeh I agree of he did that again we should just piss him off.

Yes also number 1 in having his opponent running off him and no accountability.
Ended up a 1-1 draw.

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Due to recent budget cuts and the rising cost of electricity, gas, and oil....... the Light at the End of the Tunnel has been turned off. We apologize for the inconvenience.

I beleive Kouta will play less of a midfielder in 06.
More than likely play as a Forward with midfield bursts. No way will be be able to play every minute of every game this year, he will spend a bt of time on the bench.

I'm not complaining if he plays like this. He will kick 20-30 goals (if he plays 22 games) and we know he can be effective, if lacking accountability, when he plays in the middle. With short stunts in the centre ihim being unaccountable won't be much of a problem.

I say stop bagging him for being the only person to lead. Him and Prender seem to be the only people who put their hand up and do you want Prender to be Captain . Until he retires and Lance (Hasnt set the world on fire lately) or Stevo (just as unaccountable as Kouta) takes over, then just support Kouta like you would every other Carlton Champion.

We should be taking all the 1-1 all draws we can get at the moment.
Stevens is your proposed new leader and his opponent never runs off him.

but Stevens will be here for the next 5 years.. Kouta wont...

You cant look into the future can you???

Stevens works much harder than Kouta .
Kouta does the Cliffy Young shiffle around the centre square.. he rarely raises a gallop.
His biggest weapon is his size in the middle.. a 6 ft 4 and 100 kg guy playing on 6footers 85 kgs.
Take that size aspect in close of him and he is ineffective.

What im saying is we need a player that will be there beyond a year.
Then surround him with (in the hospitality industry theyre called 'managers') everyone is a manager... so they get a sense of responsibity at the cafe/ restaurant.. they get about $1 more an hour (if that)... and there are usually a heap of them..
What that does is it spreads the accountabilty wider in the establishment.

Thats why you come across so many 'managers' from restaurants /cafes these days....

We need to do the same thing with deputies.

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You're all a discrace and should be ashamed of yourself if you think anything untoward about Kouta. Plays his guts out. Injury robbed him of being the superstar of all superstar's. He should play as long as he can. He's not doing much wrong and you cant blame him for where the club has found itself in the last few years. It's not his fault the recruiters have previously been picking duds. Who would some of you have take Kouta's place? Some of the things I see written here about our better players would make some think we have a team full of stars.... we dont full stop.

I don't think Pies supporters would not speak a bad word about thier captian and he will never play a leading role in a premiership team. Kouta did.

Shame Shame Shame.

Derryn???
Is that you???



This is about tomorrow, not a decade ago.
It can easily become another decade while we continue slapping the backs of guys who did it ten years ago....

Time stands still for nobody....

Kouta lives by what he does next year alone.. till he retires.. then we can reflect on what he did 10 years AGO!

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To whom should the shame be directed at Bax. To those engaged in constructive dialogue about a critical issue facing the club or someone like yourself who does not have the intellectual capacity to debate or consider a viewpoint contrary to the one you hold.

Anthony Koutoufides was the best player at the Carlton Football Club in 2005.

I think there was plenty of reasons why he was chosen to be captain. Cos He's a legend is 1. He's still good, 2. We are guarenteed that he will present well on and off the field, 3. Maybe some reward for being a true clubman, 4.

Pagan obviously rewards players. I believe thats why he gave Mick Martyn another shot..just so he could reward a loyal workhorse with allowing him to play his 300. There is plenty of time for Stevens, Waite, Thornton but not for poor Kouta who is an absolute star and gentlemen, he is genuinely a good person...I think it is fitting that he was given the captaincy...He can lead the youngens and he is proof that not everything about our club from the past is bad...he can provide for aslong as his career allows him, some club history and experience.

I don't understand how a player who just waltzed into our club from port Adelaide is more worthy of the captaincy than a true blue, who is obviously a fantastic bloke.....There will be plenty of time for the others but for the now, I am bloody proud the the big Kouta-man is our captain.

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The problem will be made. for the solution to be sold, to your face before your eyes, tolerance is now the new danger

Kouta isn't a great captain and doesn't exude leadership qualities but he is the best choice for the captaincy at the club at the present time. I've until this stage never been convinced that Nick Stevens should be captain, whilst he is a gun footballer I'm not sure he's captaincy potential. Hopefully in the next year or two we find some bona fide leadership material that can take over when Kouta retires. But I guess that for the moment Kouta is the best of what is a very disappointingly small pool of captaincy candidates.

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Formerly Blues-Back2003.

Read what Verbs wrote below your post. Kouta was our best player this year.

My post is aimed at all those bagging Kouta. Simple as that.

It has nothing to do with intellectual capacity. If it makes you feel better to think you're more intelligent than some one else good on you, there's a tick for your ego.

Yeh it is me.... my cover has been blown... oh well.

For those who think Kouta is a great leader. You don't watch many Carlton games closely do you. Stevo is the one who does the most talking on the ground. He is also one of the ones who shows the most emotion. This is what you want in a leader.

Kouta is a great player and a champion of the club, but NOT a leader. He may of been the best player in 05, in some of your eyes, but not in mine because my definition of good player is not stats. Its the one percenters, tackles, defensive pressure, protecting players around you, hitting targets. Kouta did not excel in these areas for a long long time. Dont let stats fool you.

Anthony Koutoufides not only won the Best and Fairest Award at the Carlton Football Club in 2005, he also received the Best Clubman Award in the same year.

Anthony Koutoufides leads the Carlton Football Club every second of every day in attitude, performance, work ethic, skill and ability, demeanour and presence around the Club.

The funny thing is, he's been doing it every day since 1994.

Well as a matter of fact my post is directed to those who try to stifle discussion by questioning the loyalty of posters. Synbad raises some very strong arguments for change. They do not in any way diminish Kouta's impressive record at the club. Although he is a legend of the club, the club must also consider ins future interests given his limited span as a footballer for the club.

Yes, I have read Verbs post but it doesn't tell me anything I did not already know. Just because Kouta is the best performed player at the club does not necessarily make him the best leadership option. There are many character traits that make a good leader.

Please don't accuse of treachery those who dare to challenge the status quo. We are a club in crisis, we need stimulate discussion on all matters relating to the Carlton Football Club to help get us out of this mess we find ourselvses in.

So in short if posters want to question the retaining of Kouta as club captain, don't accuse them of Kouta bashing. It adds little to these forums.

Well if thats the case, Pagan should get the arse at 9.00am tomorrow.
Pagans duty is to develop a list capable of bringing success to the Carlton Football Club.
How would the club sponsors react if this year is compromised by "rewarding players"?
Are they expected to pour millions of dollars into the club so we can be sentimental and carry inferior leaders to reward them?

Either Kouta's deemed the best available leader or he's not. If he's not, take the captaincy off him tomorrow.
We're coming from too far behind to be playing games.
Pagan hopefully is too smart and too ruthless to be compromised in that way.
As for Martyn the same applies. Pagan got him to top up the list and to assist a young T/Bird and Livingston. If any sentimentality was involved, he should be sacked and lined up for an arse kicking by the members and sponsors.

We are a long way behind the pack. We have to be efficient, ruthless and courageous. A lot more than we have been to date.
If we start "rewarding" players on top of the $700k+ or whatever we're paying them, we deserve to be shit forever.

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Looking forward to seeing our potential realised.

You've taken it to the extremes BlueVain, He's not going to reward Karl Norman for not having a bong for a week by giving him the captaincy.

We are yet to work out if Stevens would be the better captain or not...but you don't work from such piddly evidence for trial and error in these situations. We'd just be a laughing stock having changed our captains like we change our socks.

Whether Kouta does a fantastic job or not (I personally don't think he does) is almost irrelevant given our circumstances. He doesn't do a bad job and it seems fitting to me, that we would have a very reliable character to lead us.

Who's to say that Kouta hasn't taken a significant paycut and is currently being payed fish and chips???

What the heck is wrong with suitably rewarding players

Anyway, my initial comment about Pagan rewarding players may be off the mark...it is just one of my observations after the whole Martyn thing.....

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The problem will be made. for the solution to be sold, to your face before your eyes, tolerance is now the new danger