Embarassing???....Yes,my wife says that but it usually relates to me falling asleep at the table after a few too many!

Twisted????...Perhaps you a refering to my sense of humour?...Not that you know me ,but there would be those that would suggest it is a reasonable description..

My issue with you is that your constant whinging and negativity regarding the Club over a number of years now, gets under the skin.

Membership must be down - we're crying poor again!

That is fantstic news about the ATO though. So we just bankrupt the social club, liquidate it and never have to pay the bill, then start it up again as an operating division of the footy club?

And for those who are asking for white knights - why would you put $1m into something you don't own, run or have a say in?

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Formerly: Ackland the Wonderkid / Army the Wonderkid / quivering mess / molsey / Tony Lynn Fan Club

Well we went to the AFL for assistance on Draft Day, how is this any different?

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100% correct - a number of them are there own personal glory - nothing else. They are not blue to the core.

Some people might be willing to be "white knights" on the proviso that they be elected onto the board....in that case they DO have a say in how things are done. OR they may do it just for their own ego....to be known as the person that SAVED Carlton in their time of need. The rich supporters I previously mentioned (Pratt, Mathisen and Grollo) wouldn't miss $1m or whatever amount of money they donated.

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That's right. Gather the nector my little drones and make honey. Honey for your children.......Fools!!!

maybe they're like the real Monty Burns and abit stingy!

Maybe they will put it in if it looks like the Club will fold, but we've survived the last 4 years and looks like we're on the up, you know, maybe they dont think its necessary anymore? Maybe they saw 35000 people sign up as Blue members last year and realised that the common fan will save the club.

Maybe they are still peeved off at how we treated Elliott, or the new administration doesn't give them access to the players, or maybe they dislike Pagan and how much he gets paid.

Maybe they are just waiting til we are good again?

I don't reckon it is worth waiting for some white knight.

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Formerly: Ackland the Wonderkid / Army the Wonderkid / quivering mess / molsey / Tony Lynn Fan Club

No-one would kick in seven figures (no matter how wealthy) if they didn't have either complete confidence in the board and senior management, or a fair say in how the money is to be spent.

Also, I'm not all that comfortable with one or two benefactors propping the club up. We got ourselves into this mess, and we have no-one else to blame. The way forward is to work bloody hard and bloody intelligently to claw our way back up.

Regarding AFL assistance, what business wouldn't accept a free $1,000,000 grant? Do we let pride get in the way of a million bucks, I wonder?

As hinted before, we didn't let pride get in the way of Marc Murphy, and if many were so eager to prostitute our integrity then why not now?

I'm not saying we shouldn't have prostitued our integrity to land pick #1, just making an observation.

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Your right Camel. There is no difference and it's the same people who love the "priority" system who have their "hand" out for the funds.
Thankfully I never was and never will be for either one.

How is taking the first draft pick prostituting your integrity? The team that comes last gets the first pick. Its a statement about where you came last year, nothing about integrity. If you are convinced that this is about priority picks, then your argument should be about Josh Kennedy not Marc Murphy. Marc Murphy was always going to thebottom team - Carlton would have had the number one pick with or without the priority pick. The extra pick from sacrificing integrity is Kennedy.

I hope no one is so upset about our integrity that we wont cheer loudly for these young players now on our list. Not sure theres a difference between trying to make some sort of point now and accepting them as carlton players later?

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Formerly: Ackland the Wonderkid / Army the Wonderkid / quivering mess / molsey / Tony Lynn Fan Club

Technically the priority pick was Marc Murphy

If we need the money then I say take it, we have paid into and supported other clubs through this system when we were a wealthy successful club and its fair enough we get some of OUR money back when we need it...its about survival.

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"When you have the attitude of a champion, you see adversity as your
training partner."
- Conor Gillen

I would like to know more about all the disadvantages and advantages, but someone brought up a good point before (maybe camelboy) that the AFL could well screw us over.. .while they treat other clubs on handouts with respect eg melbourne and nth melbourne.

If we do it - i want the same deal as what they get.

But Richmond has resisted it - we should be able to stand on our own feet if richmond can..

Melbourne making a profit on the back of AFL hand outs annoys me - when Carlton is regularly in trouble.


Where is Ratten, Bradley etc.. ? why can't they give even $1000 to the Carlton foundation. It sickens me that these guys make so much money from the club and can't give something back.

Well, looking at your registration date you may not have been here last year for all the talk about tanking and the like … or were you.

The point is not whether we should have taken the pick or not, of course we should have. The point is it could be argued that we used the system to our advantage, just as other clubs have done in the past.

If we actually really genuinely need the assistance from the AFL, and there are systems in place to allow for this, why should we knock it back, or fail to explore these opportunities?

I think I'm right in thinking we would all want Carlton to be number one again, in all aspects of the game be that on or off the field. It seems many were able to embrace the concept of winning few games so that we could benefit as best as possible from the draft, and in theory this is some short term pain for long term gain. So, is seeking assistance from the AFL any different?

I'm not advocating we should do it, but if there's a need for the money, and the AFL has the required program in place to assist the club, we'd be foolish not to at least explore the possibility.

As for having no "hand" over criticising St Kilda, well that was lost about half way through season 2005. We have just as many priority picks on our list as they do. The fact we may have fewer 1st round draft selections says more about our recruiting policies than it does about St Kilda receiving any so called "hand outs".

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I reckon it would be the AFL who would look the stupid ones (not that that would be very difficult for them) giving us the $1,000,000 after fining us the same amount on Black Friday 2002, and as I understand it we never paid the fine completely till 2004 anyway, so what do the AFL call our fine a "short term loan".

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"Hence you will not say that Greeks fight like heroes but that heroes fight like Greeks"?

Winston Churchill

Thats how I've always seen it.

I just hope its accurate.

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"The ability to speak doesn't make you intelligent." Qui-Gon Jinn 15-05-2005

"there’s more chance of me becoming the full forward for the [Western Bulldogs] than there is of any change in the Labor Party." Julia Gillard 18-05-2010

Where is our membership at right now? Other clubs are flying and we seem to be wallowing badly. I've even noticed a general tendency amongst some mates and guys I know who are Carlton supporters towards not really caring about renewing memberships or even giving a stuff about the year ahead. And some of these guys were mad-Carlton for years! I think the last 4 years is starting to take a lasting toll on some of our supporters. They have had enough of supporting a club that has become a laughing stock in the AFL. Being labelled a rabble and constantly being the butt of jokes.

Acquiring CBF funding will only further degrade our standing and reputation. A dose of humility was needed at our club but the last 4 years has dropped us many more pegs than that...

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C'mon Blueboys!

Well we can either sit here in our ivory towers in TC, CSC or TBV (as it goes without saying that any posters on these forums would be diehards) and talk the club down - or get out there and get all our apathetic mates to join up.

The choice is simple - I know what I am doing.

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"Hence you will not say that Greeks fight like heroes but that heroes fight like Greeks"?

Winston Churchill

I'm trying Agro, i'm really trying. It takes more than a rant from a die-hard though. It takes wins, future prospects and some hope.

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C'mon Blueboys!

At the moment Marci - we are ALL behaving like the Judean Peoples Front and the Popular Peoples Front of Judea.

It is time we put our differences and internal squabbles and "I told you so's" aside.

There is one great common thread and that is "THE CARLTON FOOTBALL CLUB".

Talk it up ladies and gentlemen, talk it up!!!!

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"Hence you will not say that Greeks fight like heroes but that heroes fight like Greeks"?

Winston Churchill