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 Post subject: Re: List Management 2025
PostPosted: Tue Aug 19, 2025 1:29 pm 
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Craig Bradley
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SurreyBlue wrote:
Sidefx wrote:
Except for the fact he gets pushed off the ball to easily.
He needs to put on some weight before he can make an impact inside.
Plus we don't need another inside mid hanballing, we have too many of those already.
We need speed and skill by foot.


Sidefx wrote:
If you think Ollie is quick it is no wonder you think Voss can't coach.
If Ollie was quick and had good foot skills, he'd have stayed on the wing or be in the centre/half forward.
There is a reason he is in defence and there is also a reason our D50 transition is not as smooth as other teams.
The kid goes hard, has good run but like many others on our team lacks a few qualities for us to be able to play a different game style.
His best position is in defence so far, so let's leave him there.


So now it's not about just pace but his foot skills - yet Voss plays him as the distributor off the half back line.
Then you say Voss can coach - let's see if Voss gets an extension next year?

ps. It's a bit like the StKilda supporters are so happy they signed NLM for 2 years. Wonder what the discussion will be in 2027? Only another 12 months. :grin:

SB, don't set yourself up for a second year of disappointment.
Essentially hoping our team will fail so Voss will get the sack and you can be right, sounds like a grim season of football IMO.

Yes, Ollie is not an elite kick.
But he is a good 2 way runner and is the reason he is used to run so far up the ground.
The issue Voss has and you seem either unable or unwilling to accept is that we have no one else better.
Do you think Ollie would be playing that role if we had Houston?
Ollie is not a bad footballer, in fact he is coming along nicely.
He just lacks the qualities we really need to be able to play the plan B you consistently say Voss does not have, speed and skill by foot.
As do many of our other players, mind you.

If we could somehow add another half back, wing, mid and small forward with speed and skilful ball use this off season, we would be set.
I would then expect Ollie to be used in the back pocket again or be a rotating player in several positions.
Either way, he needs to work on his kicking and acceleration this off season first and foremost.
And adding a little extra weight would not go astray.


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 Post subject: Re: List Management 2025
PostPosted: Tue Aug 19, 2025 1:31 pm 
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Craig Bradley
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Effes wrote:
https://www.carltonfc.com.au/news/1868382

On the Club’s areas to address this off-season:

“We need some depth, that’s been a priority for us. It’s going back a long way: we thought the durability of the list wasn’t where it needed to be last year, we had too many soft-tissue injuries and went to work on that as a list.

“Unfortunately we’ve had a lot of different trauma injuries this year, but it has felt like we’ve controlled what we need to control and we think our high performance and medical team has done an amazing job managing our year and the program they’ve put around our players. We’ve been a little bit unlucky, and we need to ride that bit out and be really strong on the things that have worked for us within the program and keep doubling down on the things that make our program stronger.

“Ideally we want to bring in some speed and ball use. That’ll be nice on the edges to bring that. It’s nice that we’ve got some guys that haven’t played a lot of football this year that we can bring into the team immediately, which will be a difference for us in that area. Cottrell, Smith, Walsh has come back and you see the impact he has. We haven’t had these players for a lot of the year.

Yep, that pretty much sums it up.
It'll be interesting to see who comes in and who goes out.
And hopefully next season we have a bit more luck with injuries and then you never know.


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 Post subject: Re: List Management 2025
PostPosted: Tue Aug 19, 2025 5:35 pm 
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Ken Hunter
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Voss is taking no responsibility for this year's results.
It's everyone else fault, from injury management to list management.
If people are happy to listen and back this excuse - good for them, but for me it sends alarm bells.


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 Post subject: Re: List Management 2025
PostPosted: Tue Aug 19, 2025 5:44 pm 
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Ken Hunter
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I'll add - expectation was finals this year. Club set it.
Changes to the list last year were made with Voss approval. Boo Hoo if he didn't get Housten. SOOK.
Voss has failed and if the club believe they need to rebuild / reset or whatever they have once again FAILED.
I won't accept anything than finals and success while I support this club.
Loser mentality to accept anything less and believe this nonsense and keep blaming everyone else.


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 Post subject: Re: List Management 2025
PostPosted: Tue Aug 19, 2025 10:51 pm 
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Stephen Kernahan
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SurreyBlue wrote:
Voss is taking no responsibility for this year's results.
It's everyone else fault, from injury management to list management.
If people are happy to listen and back this excuse - good for them, but for me it sends alarm bells.


Has he been blaming other departments? I've not made him make any excuses this season, unlike the doppelganger at *.


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 Post subject: Re: List Management 2025
PostPosted: Wed Aug 20, 2025 9:19 am 
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Craig Bradley
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Apparently Sydney want Charlie Curnow.

No problem, just give us Isaac Heeney and you've got a DEAL !!!!

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 Post subject: Re: List Management 2025
PostPosted: Wed Aug 20, 2025 9:30 am 
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Craig Bradley
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GreatEx wrote:
SurreyBlue wrote:
Voss is taking no responsibility for this year's results.
It's everyone else fault, from injury management to list management.
If people are happy to listen and back this excuse - good for them, but for me it sends alarm bells.


Has he been blaming other departments? I've not made him make any excuses this season, unlike the doppelganger at *.

I think in SBs mind, unless Voss comes out and says it is all his fault then he is blaming everyone else but himself.


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 Post subject: Re: List Management 2025
PostPosted: Wed Aug 20, 2025 12:45 pm 
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Harry Vallence
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murraycray wrote:
Apparently Sydney want Charlie Curnow.

No problem, just give us Isaac Heeney and you've got a DEAL !!!!


If the medicals are as guarded a prognosis as I expect them to be..

McLean/Florent/future first and swap 43/61 for their 27/45.


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 Post subject: Re: List Management 2025
PostPosted: Wed Aug 20, 2025 2:37 pm 
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Craig Bradley

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Rod Spooky Galt wrote:
murraycray wrote:
Apparently Sydney want Charlie Curnow.

No problem, just give us Isaac Heeney and you've got a DEAL !!!!


If the medicals are as guarded a prognosis as I expect them to be..

McLean/Florent/future first and swap 43/61 for their 27/45.

Reckon our bloke would have a good idea of both sides of the deal.

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 Post subject: Re: List Management 2025
PostPosted: Wed Aug 20, 2025 3:01 pm 
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Geoff Southby

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Rod Spooky Galt wrote:
murraycray wrote:
Apparently Sydney want Charlie Curnow.

No problem, just give us Isaac Heeney and you've got a DEAL !!!!


If the medicals are as guarded a prognosis as I expect them to be..

McLean/Florent/future first and swap 43/61 for their 27/45.

Or maybe Hayward or Sheldrick could be part of the trade.

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 Post subject: Re: List Management 2025
PostPosted: Wed Aug 20, 2025 5:38 pm 
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Stephen Kernahan
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Interesting commentary from Daniel Hoyne re forward structure deep forward vs roaming forward.

https://x.com/SENSportsday/status/1957722696793612290

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 Post subject: Re: List Management 2025
PostPosted: Wed Aug 20, 2025 8:38 pm 
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Craig Bradley
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Effes wrote:
Interesting commentary from Daniel Hoyne re forward structure deep forward vs roaming forward.

https://x.com/SENSportsday/status/1957722696793612290


Yeah , i'll buy that .

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 Post subject: Re: List Management 2025
PostPosted: Wed Aug 20, 2025 10:22 pm 
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Stephen Silvagni

Joined: Thu Feb 02, 2006 11:03 am
Posts: 25858
Location: Bondi Beach
SurreyBlue wrote:
Voss is taking no responsibility for this year's results.
It's everyone else fault, from injury management to list management.
If people are happy to listen and back this excuse - good for them, but for me it sends alarm bells.


I’ve been really impressed with your recent posts Surrey. You stuck up for players and club for me when I had difficulties posting from Greece.

Contrary to your assertions in this post, Voss has been the most professional AFL coach this year, equal to any other, given the challenges he’s faced. Compare Chris Scott and Voss and players they’ve had at there disposal. He’s the last to blame injury, and list management, when other coaches and fans acknowledged the issues injury present.

Vossy did say it was that “ you could see how much it help the addition of one class player makes to the team “.
Read what you like from that, but he’s just pointing out the obvious and let the audience make what they like from that.

GW acknowledged what’s been said since before round 1….the club didn’t replace the experienced discarded from the list over the last 2 years. Read what you like from that.

GW also acknowledged we need more depth, but we have collated some very good youth. Read what you like of that.

I’m sure you posted you will back GWs decision about the coach. You wanted Voss gone because of your beliefs. I read a post from you that Voss was gone. I took that as gospel. Days later I read Voss has been backed. Now you’re taking pot shots at Vossy a couple weeks after the decision. Take what you want of that.

What I take from that is you are passionate about the club and 100% sure in your opinion. I don’t think any of us know what’s right and wrong and there aren’t absolutes outside the 4 walls.

Give Vossy a chance, and in fairness, back him till he is proven wrong. One year is a long time in footy. You know that. It’s also a long long way fro finals in 2026.

I think the list will be better next year, as will injury, and if that’s the case, we too will be better. We beat the Cats with 5 out. We struggled with more than 8 out. In fact, we won all our games with less than 8 out. Think what you want of that.

All we are sayingggggggg.
Is give Vossy a chance a chance

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 Post subject: Re: List Management 2025
PostPosted: Wed Aug 20, 2025 10:47 pm 
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Stephen Silvagni

Joined: Thu Feb 02, 2006 11:03 am
Posts: 25858
Location: Bondi Beach
Sidefx wrote:
SurreyBlue wrote:
Sidefx wrote:
Except for the fact he gets pushed off the ball to easily.
He needs to put on some weight before he can make an impact inside.
Plus we don't need another inside mid hanballing, we have too many of those already.
We need speed and skill by foot.


Sidefx wrote:
If you think Ollie is quick it is no wonder you think Voss can't coach.
If Ollie was quick and had good foot skills, he'd have stayed on the wing or be in the centre/half forward.
There is a reason he is in defence and there is also a reason our D50 transition is not as smooth as other teams.
The kid goes hard, has good run but like many others on our team lacks a few qualities for us to be able to play a different game style.
His best position is in defence so far, so let's leave him there.


So now it's not about just pace but his foot skills - yet Voss plays him as the distributor off the half back line.
Then you say Voss can coach - let's see if Voss gets an extension next year?

ps. It's a bit like the StKilda supporters are so happy they signed NLM for 2 years. Wonder what the discussion will be in 2027? Only another 12 months. :grin:

SB, don't set yourself up for a second year of disappointment.
Essentially hoping our team will fail so Voss will get the sack and you can be right, sounds like a grim season of football IMO.

Yes, Ollie is not an elite kick.
But he is a good 2 way runner and is the reason he is used to run so far up the ground.
The issue Voss has and you seem either unable or unwilling to accept is that we have no one else better.
Do you think Ollie would be playing that role if we had Houston?
Ollie is not a bad footballer, in fact he is coming along nicely.
He just lacks the qualities we really need to be able to play the plan B you consistently say Voss does not have, speed and skill by foot.
As do many of our other players, mind you.

If we could somehow add another half back, wing, mid and small forward with speed and skilful ball use this off season, we would be set.
I would then expect Ollie to be used in the back pocket again or be a rotating player in several positions.
Either way, he needs to work on his kicking and acceleration this off season first and foremost.
And adding a little extra weight would not go astray.


That’s so nice of you to write about Ollie in this way. So unusual for you.

He’s 20yo.

When I was 20yo, I was a good right foot kick. Left was a bomb only
When I was 22yo, I was a good right foot kick. Left passing sorta ok.
When I was 24yo, I could kick well both sides and my left was deadly and preferred foot at goal.

Ollie wasn’t and isn’t elite, but he was pretty good, and will get better.

Ollie is a fantastic player and was picked in best 22 since 18yo. He is all the positives you said, but you said in the past he’s not a best 23 player.

Last week you alluded he was slow. He’s our go to player to run the ball out of defense, earmarked mid to run forward of ball and in forward line because he can run. He’s NOT slow. I agree with SB you are hard to follow re Ollie. Do you know why?

As for Houston. Fkn hell, we dodged another bullet, a Shiel kind of bullet.

For Voss, Houston was an opportunity. Houston came to Voss, who came to the List Committee. The List Committee didn’t go that way, and Voss moved on from that. $800k. Vossy didn’t sook as Surrey says. He moved on. The List Committee Austin, Cook, Voss, Lloyd underestimated our depth. That’s all.

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 Post subject: Re: List Management 2025
PostPosted: Wed Aug 20, 2025 11:06 pm 
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Stephen Silvagni

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Posts: 25858
Location: Bondi Beach
Effes wrote:
Interesting commentary from Daniel Hoyne re forward structure deep forward vs roaming forward.

https://x.com/SENSportsday/status/1957722696793612290


Thanks Effes
Great listen with all this glare at Kalamata Beach.

100% agree with all of it.
Success in every position is dependent on fitness of player to carry out role.
Charlie wasn’t and isn’t not fit this year, regardless what Voss said.

Charlie has an engine. Always did.
Fit, he could play midfield as he did in TAC

I always thought Harry had more weapons to mark at FF than Charlie.
Harry also has speed, where charli3 has endurance.
Hence, Harry can put on forward pressure and catch defenders, and one on one is more of a chance to mark.
Also, if Harry gives ruck a chop out, he doesn’t use as much energy at FF as he would as a roaming CHF, and hit up from defence.

Crusader has been screaming Cripps in forwardline, not just to mix it up and give our midfield a different look, but to increase rotations in our midfield too. Also as a forward for all the reasons Haynes suggested.

These adjust some of the moves that will help us next year.

Glad CC was operated on a couple of weeks ago to get him ready for a decent preseason.

Hewett is the bomb. I’d love to smack his knockers. He’s the real deal. Listen to the comparisons Haynes makes. I’ve always agreed ther3 and couldn’t believe we got him from Swans so cheap.

Walsh is like a new player next year, and Smith will be one year older and champing at the bit

Harry Charlie Smith Walsh hardly played this year.
Get them fit, and the addition of 4 fit class players next year, and watch out.

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 Post subject: Re: List Management 2025
PostPosted: Wed Aug 20, 2025 11:12 pm 
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Stephen Silvagni

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Humpers wrote:
Rod Spooky Galt wrote:
murraycray wrote:
Apparently Sydney want Charlie Curnow.

No problem, just give us Isaac Heeney and you've got a DEAL !!!!


If the medicals are as guarded a prognosis as I expect them to be..

McLean/Florent/future first and swap 43/61 for their 27/45.

Or maybe Hayward or Sheldrick could be part of the trade.


Swans are keen on any class KPF. Not sure if Charlie would be let go tho.

All I’m hearing is we’ve got the class but not the depth.
Letting go our KPF requires that spot to be filled.
Kemp is not Charlie. Who else? Lemmey? Miles off it.

Our window will determine if we let Charlie go…..or a deal we can’t refuse

Obviously Charlie has committed to the baggers in public, but he’s also had discussions with the club on possible trade. He’s contracted, so it has to suit Carlton first and foremost.

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 Post subject: Re: List Management 2025
PostPosted: Wed Aug 20, 2025 11:15 pm 
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Stephen Silvagni

Joined: Thu Feb 02, 2006 11:03 am
Posts: 25858
Location: Bondi Beach
Rod Spooky Galt wrote:
murraycray wrote:
Apparently Sydney want Charlie Curnow.

No problem, just give us Isaac Heeney and you've got a DEAL !!!!


If the medicals are as guarded a prognosis as I expect them to be..

McLean/Florent/future first and swap 43/61 for their 27/45.


Oh spooky, I love the way your mind works.
Missed you whilst you were on vacation.

Keep feeding us the complex matrix that goes on between your ears, and say gday to Galty junior Greg. Great player too. My old capt coach

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 Post subject: Re: List Management 2025
PostPosted: Wed Aug 20, 2025 11:16 pm 
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Stephen Silvagni

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Location: Bondi Beach
GreatEx wrote:
SurreyBlue wrote:
Voss is taking no responsibility for this year's results.
It's everyone else fault, from injury management to list management.
If people are happy to listen and back this excuse - good for them, but for me it sends alarm bells.


Has he been blaming other departments? I've not made him make any excuses this season, unlike the doppelganger at *.


From the wonderful world of GE

Agree.

Weird stuff man

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 Post subject: Re: List Management 2025
PostPosted: Wed Aug 20, 2025 11:19 pm 
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Stephen Silvagni

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I’m most interested/ intrigued which rucks we are targeting.

It’s obvious TDK is going and publicly we turn to Pitto, but I just don’t think we can rely on OKeeffe, because Pitto will not play fit all season, let alone be fit for selection.

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 Post subject: Re: List Management 2025
PostPosted: Wed Aug 20, 2025 11:53 pm 
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Stephen Kernahan
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Sidefx wrote:
GreatEx wrote:
Has he been blaming other departments? I've not made him make any excuses this season, unlike the doppelganger at *.

I think in SBs mind, unless Voss comes out and says it is all his fault then he is blaming everyone else but himself.


I did wonder if that was the case, but didn't want to jump the gun. Only seppuku will do.


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