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KERMIT
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PostPosted: Mon May 22, 2006 12:44 pm 
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Rod McGregor

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Everybody has thier own opinion on the matter bnz.

Yes our forward line might be light on next year if we traded Fev but as Kennedy comes along and Fisher and Waite continue to impose a presence plus perhaps a Hartlet, Raso or someone else we pick up in this year or subsequent drafts makes an impact on balance we MAY be better off.

The crucial difference between our views is that you are not prepared to contemplate some long term pain for long term gain. Obviously if any deal on Fev were below what we required then don't do it.

I say it again when StKilda let Hall go they didn't know Reiwalt and Kosi were on the horizone but they took a view and the hard decision and they have come out ahead.
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Synbad
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PostPosted: Mon May 22, 2006 12:45 pm 
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Bruce Doull
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bnz wrote:
No seriously....it's a great idea to trade fev....awesome idea....trade our only forward so eventually when we do have a midfield capable of delivering quality ball, we have no one to kick it to....its a brilliant idea... :shock: :shock:

and while we are at it, the only guy who has stood up in defence all year, who some idiots call "positionless" or i like to refer to as capable of playing multiple positions, lets trade him too, and leave our defence with just thornton who is already out of his depth as number 2 defender to take the number one forward....great logic....yep trade lance, he's crap, trade fev for a midfield so they can get it and kick it to?????????? :shock: :shock: :shock: :shock: :shock: :shock: :shock: :shock: :shock:

Ok so Croad KILLED him... Richo KILLED him...Riewoldt KILLED him...Anyone who can get out of a jog will kill him when hes in defence....

So whats his position???

A flooding loose man ???(Thats a bit of an oxymoron i realise.. but his best possie is the loose man in a flood!!!)...

How the hell can you have that as your position if youre trying to improve???

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tap in 79
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PostPosted: Mon May 22, 2006 12:45 pm 
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Rod Ashman
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Synbad wrote:
jimmae wrote:
It's a reasonable and cheap bandaid in this case Synners, your biggest problem (IMO) is that you keep heaping what we do each year draft/trade time and point at the aggrigate result and exercising hind sight on draft picks.

Hardly a fair place to take potshots from. The Saddington trade was a sound one and we haven't lost out yet just because he doesn't dive into a pack (where he would probably be snapped in half anyway).


I was against Saddington from the moment i heard about that.... !!!

Same with McLaren....

Did he really offer more today against the worst ruck combo in the league than French would have???

The problem with French is the way Denis asks him to play....

Same as every other player on our list....

If you really analyse things youd realise... denis has every player on our list just about playing in a fashion that Denis would dream for them to play.. not what they really ARE!!!...

Betts is a midfielder now...
Simmo is a back pocket.
McGrath is a defender.
Saddington KP.
Walker a tagger.
Scotland is a hbflanker... (not sure why we took him .. he was a midfielder)
Carazzo... not sure but in a game where we need the ball.. and he can find the ball.. hes a tagger...
Houla is the sweeper along with Lappiun but theyre forwards...
Stevens isnt an attacking footballer hes behind the ball...
Lance is a CHB...
Fev is a FF but he must run with the defender.. so the opposition coach says to the FB.. run to the centre.. and Fev now has to run out of the 50 meter arc...
Digby had to put on 10 kilos and then take it back off...(CHF)
Russell is a tagger .... but he used to be a flanker/wingman with run out...


We will probably turn Kennedy into a ruckmen. (we need one)
Murph will be a tagger....




It goes on and on....


People are good at some things... and thats how they should be played!!!


Firstly can I say that supporting Carlton in the last 4 years has been painful..95% pain 5% joy or happiness.

I am tired of those odds... and have recently taken more interest in seeing games involving Chris Judd than watching Carlton.

Synbad, I nearly always find your pieces informative.

Can I ask you if you are saying that any of the above positions are preferred positions - what do you think are the preferred positions for these players:

1) lappin

2) houlihan..personally i am tired of seeing him in the midfield.

3) walker

4) betts

5) Carazzo.

I think seeing Marc Murphy in attack more often would be good - instead of resting him on the bench so often. He has no fear when shooting for goal and there are a lack of crumbers in the forward line.
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Synbad
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PostPosted: Mon May 22, 2006 12:48 pm 
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Bruce Doull
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Walker on a wing.
Betts forward pocket for now.
Lappin and Houla are hffs.. and should be given roles there to create goals more often than they are.
whens the last time Houla has been past the half way line???

Carazzo is a genuine ball winner... you play him where the ball is at.. (midfield)
He will guarantee we get our hands on the ball... same with Scotland

In a game of posessions we dont have our players who can win possessions in the spots that you can win the ball..

how weird is that???

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Sniff Wilson
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PostPosted: Mon May 22, 2006 12:50 pm 
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Wayne Johnston
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Synbad wrote:
Carazzo is a genuine ball winner... you play him where the ball is at..


he also has some of the WORST decision making i have ever seen and his disposal by foot is woeful......but yeah put him on the ball....he attracts it, awesome, then like scotland he can turn it over....... :roll:

carrazzo is a back pocket player at best. i would be more willing, a lot more willing to put wiggins on the ball than carrazzo (sorry fullmont)

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Synbad
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PostPosted: Mon May 22, 2006 12:55 pm 
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Bruce Doull
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bnz wrote:
Synbad wrote:
Carazzo is a genuine ball winner... you play him where the ball is at..


he also has some of the WORST decision making i have ever seen and his disposal by foot is woeful......but yeah put him on the ball....he attracts it, awesome, then like scotland he can turn it over....... :roll:

carrazzo is a back pocket player at best. i would be more willing, a lot more willing to put wiggins on the ball than carrazzo (sorry fullmont)


Thats not true....

I think Dane Swan and Ben Johnson had the worst decision making i had ever seen.. funny what abit of confidence and a game plan that suits the team and the players can do to a kid....

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Sniff Wilson
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PostPosted: Mon May 22, 2006 12:56 pm 
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Wayne Johnston
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funny what impact having quality players around you does too eh?

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Synbad
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PostPosted: Mon May 22, 2006 12:58 pm 
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Bruce Doull
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bnz wrote:
funny what impact having quality players around you does too eh?


But isnt about what you do with players?

for instance if you coached a group of players and i coached the same group of players wed get two different results..

Its not the players why they have improved , its because they have a clue what theyre doing.

Our players train hard to be clueless on field.. simple...

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jimmae
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PostPosted: Mon May 22, 2006 1:01 pm 
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Bruce Doull
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Any moment where I appear to have taken mojo as gospel is a failure on my part to say otherwise. Just wanted to clear that up.

Lappin on the HFF? Sometimes yeah, but he's a utility, he is perfectly fine as a HBF and if he adds composure down there, why wouldn't you use him there?

I'd have Walker on either of the wing of HBF. Betts FP maybe pushing onto the flank. I agree on Carrots and Houla but Houla provides more in the middle for us at the moment.
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Sniff Wilson
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PostPosted: Mon May 22, 2006 1:02 pm 
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Wayne Johnston
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why do you think carrazzo was ROOKIE listed and not drafted by geelong? why did he spend a couple of years there with no progress? why did they let him go? because his by foot disposal and decision making are atrocious. i like carrots, he is hard at it, but he lacks the skill required to hold a midfield spot, not matter who coaches him. thats my point.

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Synbad
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PostPosted: Mon May 22, 2006 1:06 pm 
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Bruce Doull
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bnz wrote:
why do you think carrazzo was ROOKIE listed and not drafted by geelong? why did he spend a couple of years there with no progress? why did they let him go? because his by foot disposal and decision making are atrocious. i like carrots, he is hard at it, but he lacks the skill required to hold a midfield spot, not matter who coaches him. thats my point.

You have no idea have you?
Sure they didnt need him.. but he did win their reserves BnF at 19 and that included players that are currently there..

He lacks the skill just like all of our other players because they dont know what theyre doing out there... sure it can be about clever fotballers.. but 90% of footballers out there are developed.. Look at sydney and Adelaide.. who the hell did they draft?????

But theyre out there being proactive with the lists they have not blaming recruiting or players like we do....!!!

were just a shit club for a footballer to come to and learn the caper.. thats all!!

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Elwood Blues1
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PostPosted: Mon May 22, 2006 1:09 pm 
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Mike Fitzpatrick

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bnz wrote:
why do you think carrazzo was ROOKIE listed and not drafted by geelong? why did he spend a couple of years there with no progress? why did they let him go? because his by foot disposal and decision making are atrocious. i like carrots, he is hard at it, but he lacks the skill required to hold a midfield spot, not matter who coaches him. thats my point.


Dont disagree with that....Carrazzo is a nice goer but to me if he has a future its going to be as a Steven Baker tagger run with type.....doesnt have the class to match it with A graders .
Bentick is similar and from what I have seen I think Jess Smith is along the same lines....all goers but just lack the polish to match it with Judd, Hayes, Ball, Dal Santo etc....

Dane Swan and Johnson have suprised but over the journey I think they will be found out ...I think Swan and Johnson are important as a second tier to the main group cos you need your blue collar workers though and maybe thats the future for Carrots and co...

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Last edited by Elwood Blues1 on Mon May 22, 2006 1:12 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Sniff Wilson
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PostPosted: Mon May 22, 2006 1:11 pm 
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Wayne Johnston
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murphy seems to have picked it up ok? kennedy's skills seem to be ok....and they are in their first season....so why, carrazzo, three seasons in still cant decide between kicking to a man open or a three on one contest and then still miss the target by 10 meters?????

we shouldnt be bringing kids to the club who we have to teach footy.....the people we bring in should know how to play the game, should have the fundamental skills required to play the game at a competetive level......

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Synbad
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PostPosted: Mon May 22, 2006 1:22 pm 
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Bruce Doull
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bnz wrote:
murphy seems to have picked it up ok? kennedy's skills seem to be ok....and they are in their first season....so why, carrazzo, three seasons in still cant decide between kicking to a man open or a three on one contest and then still miss the target by 10 meters?????

we shouldnt be bringing kids to the club who we have to teach footy.....the people we bring in should know how to play the game, should have the fundamental skills required to play the game at a competetive level......

dont worry about Murph our next back pocket and Kennedy our next ruckman.....

And i never said you dont need the tip of the spear.. of course you do...

But you need your Carazzos too... do you really think other clubs dont have a few Carazzos???



Carazzo is a very capable footballer... played out of position...
Not a star!!!.. but can play the game at senior AFL level...and should be developed to be like a Licuria...


Whod shit it in to play games for us... but hardly super skillful... or do you disagree with that too???

The AFL is littered with players like these who get developed to play games of good football...

Of course you need more!!... but most of your players are Carazzos...at most clubs...!!!

Youre never going to be lucky enough to have 30 Murphy /Judd types on your list.. its what you do with the others that makes ALL of the difference!!!...

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Sniff Wilson
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PostPosted: Mon May 22, 2006 1:25 pm 
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Wayne Johnston
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seriously though man, i fail to understand how you can rate carrazzo but not lance.....just stupid.

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Synbad
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PostPosted: Mon May 22, 2006 1:38 pm 
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Bruce Doull
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bnz wrote:
seriously though man, i fail to understand how you can rate carrazzo but not lance.....just stupid.


I never said i dont rate Lance.. i dont over rate him.. and he isnt what WE NEED!!!.. Were rebuilding.. thats all...!!!

He wont be part of anything significant but can help something significant come to us ...

I think ive explained what i believe about LAnce...

He has no upside but alot of downside...

His upside is only in finding a gun kid to draft with his pick that will serve us for 12 years and not 2.

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Blue Vain
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PostPosted: Mon May 22, 2006 1:40 pm 
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Stephen Kernahan

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jimmae wrote:
Any moment where I appear to have taken mojo as gospel is a failure on my part to say otherwise. Just wanted to clear that up.


Clear as mud to me. :shock:

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The Tyrant
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PostPosted: Mon May 22, 2006 1:46 pm 
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jimmae wrote:
Any moment where I appear to have taken mojo as gospel is a failure on my part to say otherwise. Just wanted to clear that up..


yeah... for fear of being an e-thug.... that actually doesn't make sense.

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pj_canus
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PostPosted: Mon May 22, 2006 1:49 pm 
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Rod McGregor

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I loved this from Stevo

Quote:
And Lance has been sensational. It's good to see him, to be blunt, shut a few people up and play some good footy.

"He's a quality footballer and people haven't known the injuries that he's played with the last few years.

"He's struggled to be fit week in, week out . . . so it's good that he got through a good pre-season and it's showing. He's probably in career-best form.


http://www.heraldsun.news.com.au/footy/common/story_page/0,8033,19200933%255E19762,00.html
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The Tyrant
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PostPosted: Mon May 22, 2006 1:49 pm 
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Stephen Kernahan
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Synbad wrote:
He has no upside but alot of downside....


not "down"side.. Synners.... you're thinking of his BACKside...

WHOO HOO!!!! the 5 MILLIONTH LANCE IS FAT JOKE ON TC!!! YESS!!!!! WHAT AN HONOUR!!!!! I'D LIKE TO THANK SYNBAD FOR MOTIVATING ME THROUGH THE DARK TIMES OF HIS FITNESS!!!!!!

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