Hit,nail....head!

5 years ago Pagan inherited a list that was short of mid tiered and mid-aged players.What's happened?...Houlahan from 1999,three first rounders from 2000,plus a number of kids/rookies etc since have not stepped up.

I personally don't believe it can all be put down to the wrong kids being recruited.
It starts at the top and how they have been developed and nurtured!

If Waite stopped doing the cha cha when he attempts to take a mark he would be the leading mark taker in the league. Skills Skill Skills is the problem all our players have.

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Mjonc signing off at 8888

dom do I detect a change of attitude towards Pagan in this post .

If so you can PM the apology for all that abuse and sarcasm directed at me last year, No need to post it here

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If you allow the Government to change the Laws in an emergency
They will create an Emergency to change the Laws

yes SB what will you do with the majority supporting you

As for Waite he is not a superstar and I still think he will never be a CHF not because of our development but because he lacks the nous. I'd love him to be played at CHB for the rest of the year (when he returns of course, not on 1 leg).

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This type of slight is alien in the more cultured part of the world - Walsh. Its up there with mad dogs, Englishmen and the midday sun!

Not sure where you got the "abuse " from SB.Not my style really,argue yes,personal abuse no!

I have never been one to publicly knock the Club,but if you read my posts i have shown a disatisfaction with the Game Plan for a number of years.

As for this thread i re-iterate my concern about the mentoring and development of younger players over the last 5 years.

That view is not a new one for me .

Abuse was probably the wrong word

I dont think I knock the club but have had major issues with Pagan and Collins for some time .

One gone

The other is still annoying me

PS - I enjoyed those arguements

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If you allow the Government to change the Laws in an emergency
They will create an Emergency to change the Laws

Waite has been poor this year.

It's just that for mine you can't really blame Pagan for players not winning clearances.
50% more clearances gave them a lot of inside 50's and goals from Riewoldt and friends marks. Our centre square players were solid brown.
They led by 41 points at quarter time. They had 14 scoring shots in the first quarter, thats one every two or so minutes. The gap in class beat any game plan for mine. We had one of our not too uncommon poor starts and their very talented team who has the acid poured on them came out and pumped us.
Players won't run and carry when your already sat back on your arse in one quarter. The wheels fell off and kept rolling, a symptom of a side with an losing complex. Look I'm losing faith in him too but Pagan can't make the decisions for them on the ground. The on-field leaders should be accountable and they (through Stevo) have admitted their failings. Pagan well he's not admitting anything except there no hidden superstars on Royal Parade. I personally can't excuse the players and to a much lesser extent the coaching staff...must have been great inside stuff from TD.

The first quarter had little to do with clearances Bookie.

10 of their 14 scoring shots resulted from Carlton having control of the ball in the backline and coughing it up due to being unable to penetrate St Kildas zone.

It was a basic inability to counteract a tactic St Kilda have employed for 3 years.
Either the coach has no concept of how to implement a countering plan (which I believe is so) or he cant get the players to implement it.

Either way it's an indictment on those in charge.

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Looking forward to seeing our potential realised.

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I am sick of the endless discussion of whether our list is good enough .

..... Is Waite ever going to be a top performer?

..... Is Bentick the next Williams or not?

..... Are our kids as good as we think or do we over rate them?

etc. etc. etc. etc.

The fact is that recruiting is a very very inexact science!! Add to that the probability that the rating or assessment of a young player of 17 can be totally different to his rating at 21. They change ..... improve .... at different rates ....... or they fail to improve much. There are various factors at work ...... but one important one!

There are around 2,500 U18 players in the AFL feeder system - TAC Cup, SA, WA comps etc. They are the best of of wider group playing other levels. From the 2,500, 60 to 70 get drafted.

Sure, you can make better or worse choices with draft picks .... that is going to happen at all clubs.

Sure, you hope to land a Judd or a Delidio ..... or pick up a late pick that others overlooked.

BUT remember, .... you are still taking from the elite pool of 60 odd - they are ALL elite. Some clearly stand out at that age, some less so. But they have ALL proved that have the raw material to make an AFL player.

There may be 10% difference is skills, ability, etc amongst that pool of 60. Ok let's say 20% ...... that's stretching it. BUT .......When they are drafted they are no more than 50% of the player that they could be ... or should be at 21.

What determines their rate of development, improvement?

Each week our selected side may lack the number of proven A grade players of say a West Coast or the Saints. No argument. And our list may not run as deep in quality through the 44 as compared to other teams. But when we field a team of 22, each week there is no reason why we should not be competitive ..... especially in an 'even' competition as the AFL curently is.

The players as a team need clear strategy, clear purpose, self belief, confidence in a plan. These are powerful 'weapons'. Elite sport is played 'between the ears'. Lack of consistency should not be blamed on the youth factor. There is NO reason why a young team cannot be consistent!
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Don't forget the part that was edited from the official website.
Blues make like Socceroos in a bid to get back among the goals - The Age.

Which sites do you think Fevola was referring to?

I hope they enjoyed this thread!