It was Pagan's idea to put Flouride in water.

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With regards to your second paragraph, the majority did not agree with Cammo's methods - so it was hardly "high 5's and backslapping" all round. And Cammo's views are not new - since 2003, there have been supporters who think Pagan's methods and results are not up to scratch.

However, I'd say that both Stevens and Fev's media appearances in support of Pagan are at least partially a response to Cammo's call for Pagan's head. There is little doubt that their comments are damage control by the club - players don't come out in support of a coach just for the heck of it. Of course this doesn't mean both these players didn't mean what they said just as we can't be 100% certain they aren't embellishing their statements in order to sway Joe Public that everything is great at the club.

My personal opinion is that things are not perfect between the playing group and the coach and this has been an on-again-off-again issue since 2003. Recent media from the club seem to support this - 1. Collo has been quoted as telling Pagan to "let the players enjoy their footy" - the inference being that they're not all together happy. 2. The club as asked Pagan to tone down the authoratarian approach - once again this indicates some player dissatisfaction with Pagan's approach. 3. The club has asked Pagan to implement a youth policy - once again indicating the club has been less than happy with Pagan's development of the list.

These recent statements tend to show that perhaps everything is not as hunky dory as Fev makes out. I agree with Jim that performances over the years have shown that their has been player dissatisfaction with the coach (and club perhaps). Something is wrong and it's not just the list. There's too much smoke to keep on pretending there's no fire.

I heard Pagan caused the hole in the ozone layer too

The thalidomide crisis?

Pagan approved the drug.

It was Pagan who set up the filter for the word 'cock'.

Pagan caused the West Gate bridge collapse

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Richard Pratt - A Carlton legend.

Drugs in schools?

Pagan managed the distribution channels. Apparently one of the few success directly attributed to him.

"We have a process in place and we are confident of the process, El Salvador. The process will take care of itself."

Must be terrible not to have a valid point in support of the Master...

Who says we're pro-Pagan?

Awfully blasé of you jim.

Well actually.............. you did!

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Looking forward to seeing our potential realised.

If you'e not then you're doing a good impersonation of them.



Whats blasé got to do with anything? And who's Jim?

Automatically thought you were another poster, apologies.

Yes I'm pro-Pagan, when you look at the alternative, but not everybody posting there is.

Bit harsh to throw them all in the one basket.

So that should have read:

Who says we're all pro-Pagan? Awfully blasé of you billy_bongo.

Ha ha.....sucked in!!!!!!.......lol!

Okay guys, enough of the untamed wit. Any of you want to venture an opinion as to exactly what Pagan is responsible for at the club. Apparently not for the performance of the team, which begs the question as to why we are paying bucketloads of dough if he has no responsibility for how we play.

Who is responsible for setplays, tactics and strategies (We have none, or at least none that are original or effective)
Who is responsible for improving the skills of the players?
Who is responsible for proactive coaching on match day?

I'm not a Pagan hater but I reckon he is being out thought by the younger coaches and for the money he is on he needs to do more than tell us that 'Gee wouldn't you love a Chris Judd', 'Gee its tough' I mean we are as bad as we were in 2003. No matter what the state of the list, it should improve over 4 years. Anyone think we would be this bad if we'd let Britts serve the final year of his contract and then got Eade (who was available and looking for a job).

We keep whinging about how much dough Kouta or Whitnall or Fev or Stevens is getting and the responsibilities that go with it, what does the coach need to do to justify his salary, make sure the players have the correct numbers on before they run out, or is there more to it than that.

Pagan faked the moon landings.

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Pagan, using a time machine, travelled to pre-Christian Europe and created a religion in his name, based on the chipping game.

The story of Noah was also based on Pagan's gameplan

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Love Cricket? Love me

Jim's the handsome devil who posts on TalkingCarlton!!!!

That would require planning, drafting of employees and a degree of youth training......the jury would have found Denis not guility on all counts...

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"When you have the attitude of a champion, you see adversity as your
training partner."
- Conor Gillen

Pagan did draft LA & Karl

Dont think LA and Karl could run a successful business..more likely be unreliable customers....

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"When you have the attitude of a champion, you see adversity as your
training partner."
- Conor Gillen