After reading the article in the Pssst section of the age sport, we must be loading up on early picks to pay for the 3 F/Ss in Johston, Williams and Sheldon.

1 on super-draft talent and 17, 18 and 34 on the boys .

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Unfortunately, it doesn't work that way. The draft selection forsaken for a father-son choice must be the earliest the club has within that round.

If we have 1 and 15 in the first round, and need to use one for father-son, then we have to use '1'.

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"The old believe everything, the middle-aged suspect everything, and the young know everything." Oscar Wilde

Yes I can understand that.

I just want to see the kids (2002 draft onwards) get opportunities to "play" in the thick of it. As part of the rotation and stop this Kouta/Scotland/Stevens 20 minutes a quater in the midfield garbage.

If that measn 3 wins or 8 I dont really care. I want to see Carrazzo come back in and play on the ball and see if his disposal is up to it. Take players on and run and run. Not a defensive tagger or a back pocket. 10 to 15 minutes a quater for 4 or 5 games on the ball (2 by 5 min bursts a quater)
Then go down back for a rest and some bench time as well.

Have a look after those 5 games and see how he is going. Same for a bunch of other kids. Then get to the end of the year and see how they have gone and make some decisions on them based on if they are progressing as midfielders. Use the lighter bodied Kade, Muprhy for 5 minutes to 10 a quater in there.

Stop picking the team based on age and experience. Then slotting the kids in the flanks, pockets,VFL, bench around them. Mix it up.

1 senior midfielder (Kouta, Stevens, Scotland) at least in there for experience and organisation and no more than 2. Then at least 1 kid in Carrazzo,AB etc in there to ease the load and slowly develop.

I wrote something on this on Friday and started a rant on it.

Maximize what we have got. The problem is who knows what we do have when they are played on the periphery with a ?????/ game plan and no structure and a defeatist attitude. We are wasting the year.

I want to know at the end of the year if Carrazzo is progressing with his disposal in the midfield. I want to know if the lighter bodies Betts, Simpson can develop as centre square players or they are going to be wingmen (Kade) and FP (Betts). I want to see if AW has developed his smarts to play a bit of midfield.
I want to see if AB can play midfield up against quality. Is his lack of real zip a huge insurmountable problem or is it managable?

Can we use Wiggins as a lock down player for a bit off the bench.

Etc.

Would also shift Lance forward when its at all possible. Would try Kennedy down back later in the year for a go. When Hartlett is fit again and has a bit of form I would bring him in and try up forward in the AFL. Dont like him down back.
I dont think Kennedy will be up to it either down back but I would have a look. Helps going into this draft to see in case Sellar/Gumbleton at CHF is right on our cross hairs and we can start to manipulate the chess pieces now to get an idea before we have to make the decision.

Mojo, I'm not sure if you are able to answer this but are aware of what the relationship is like between the players and Pagan?

Over the last few weeks we've had senior players come out in support of him, yet I got the impression from Lappin yesterday and marciblue also mentioned about Whitnall earlier, that perhaps the players aren't too happy with the defensive tactics being thrust upon them.

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That's right. Gather the nector my little drones and make honey. Honey for your children.......Fools!!!

Mojo, all that experimentation will lose games but will benefit the club long term and i agree.
I also agree Hartlett is not a defender long term and he has the makings of a very good forward with his mark/ kick style.
By playing the kids in the key roles we wont win this year.. but we will begin the wheels rolling forward for the future.

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Due to recent budget cuts and the rising cost of electricity, gas, and oil....... the Light at the End of the Tunnel has been turned off. We apologize for the inconvenience.

[quote="mojo31"]

I just want to see the kids (2002 draft onwards) get opportunities to "play" in the thick of it. As part of the rotation and stop this Kouta/Scotland/Stevens 20 minutes a quater in the midfield garbage.

Stop picking the team based on age and experience. Then slotting the kids in the flanks, pockets,VFL, bench around them. Mix it up.

Maximize what we have got. The problem is who knows what we do have when they are played on the periphery with a ?????/ game plan and no structure and a defeatist attitude. We are wasting the year.


Exactly.....this is what is %$#@& me off at the moment. I don't mind us losing (actually I do but I am realistic as to where we are as a team). This year I'm concerned about the amount of game time the youngsters get.

I didn't see the Adelaide game but someone apparently Kennedy didn't get much of a run in the 3rd and 4th quarters because we were against the wind......what garbage. Doesn't he also have to get experience in how to play under these conditions?

I want our kids to be given more game time.....not just games of 5 minutes per quarter.

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That's right. Gather the nector my little drones and make honey. Honey for your children.......Fools!!!

Its not great. What worries me is that the senior players have "tolerated" him and to be honest some of them over the journey have been prima donnas and like things there way and I can understand some problems coaching them.
But Denis has usually got along well (relatively) with the younger blokes who have only known life under Denis. But even that is fraying around the edges at the moment. With coaches looking to splinter certain groups of players and point at team selctions over youth and justify things.
Playing 1 off against another and not talking to others. Its like being in politics to be honest and dealing with factions. Buts its the coach who is driving it and making it a difficult place to play and develop with these sort of things.

I mean if you play a kid and he gets 2 possessions and you can then drop him and its looks perfectly reasonable. But that same kid has got 30 minutes of game time only and the MC are strangling the kid.

Its not just games, but the role they play and actual ground time that counts more.

In the current environment its very taxing on coaches and players. Its depressing and the players are not enjoying it. Even experienced coaches like Denis can get worn down with the politics and lack of talent. They can run out of ideas. Sometimes you need to step back a little to move forwards.

We need to step back a little I think.

Thats my non answer and as best as I can do on a forum at the moment.

Am I right in saying that out of the first 7-8 picks only one of them is a midfielder? If this is correct then there is a advantage in finishing last. If there is not much between these 7-8 players then the next criteria for selection must be what do you really need? If Gibbs is the only midfielder in that 7-8 then you have an advantage over the rest with the first selection. Sheedy has already stated that he wants a midfielder with leg speed with his first pick. We have lots of holes but if our recruiting staff can't clearly distinguish the quality of a tall compared to the quality of a midfielder in this draft then I would hope we select the midfielder.

did someone mention Gibbs?

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Love Cricket? Love me

Process and not the score is what counts. Forget about the score and worry about the youth and how they are developing and slowly move forward. That does not mean we "tank" or play kids who are not ready or up to it.

An exaomple would be to play Lance on the HFF and have Kennedy next to him. Or swap them over and Lance can teach Kennedy about when to lead and positioning and we can use Lance and his best asset (his brain) to fast track a kids development. Could do the same thing down back with he and Kennedy. Or Bower at the end of the year if back up and going after a knee scope.
Or Hartlett out of the pocket next to Fev and both can change it up. Fev can teach Hartlett about leading and timing things and creating a hit of space. Fev decoy and Hartlett the real target. Then change it.

Then try Hartlett at CHF next to Lance and see how he goes. Again with a senior player developing a kid.

Of course Hartlett needs to be fit and some form in the VFL to justify a game but I am talking rounds 15 to 20.

I would bring in JR this week as he is fit and in good form and start his real development now as well.

I think it was Selwood.

Just expanding on the possibility that DP & co. are tanking, maybe the aim is to finish with 4 wins or less to reinforce the argument/plea that we should qualify for a pre-1st round priority pick in the draft this year. Not sure how much scope there is for the AFL to amend this rule to accomodate our situation (18 points in 2005, 16 or less points in 2006) but the club may have some grounds to argue that the objective of the priority pick, especially pre-1st round, is to assist clubs that have endured prolonged poor performance. And their is no doubt that we fit that description!

It would be considered an injustice given our parlous state both financially and from an on-field perspective to be prohibited from such a priority pick by half a game given the rules were changed mid stream (between 05/06) and that it perhaps unfairly excludes as from this remedy.

AFAIC, it was very odd that the club raised this prospect with the AFL in their recent meeting at all as it would be pointless discussing this alteration before knowing our win/loss ratio for the year...

Maybe we're hellbent on giving the AFL some undeniable reasons by having a very poor 2006

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C'mon Blueboys!

Selwood makes it 2 with Gibbs. Others might join them like Collard, Proud, Jetta depending on the upcoming U18 Championships.

Why is it an advantage finishing last when Gibbs could go at 1,2,3,4 or 5?

The 2nd round pick will have 10 to 15 midfield prospects of Thomas/Ellis level. Thats what people dont seem to be picking up. If you miss out on Gibbs or Selwood then thats it and there are no runners left. Thats not the case.
There are heaps of talented prospects far far in advance of the runners last year.

If we finish the first 3 rounds of drafting and have not snagged some run them we do have a problem. But if we take 1 first up or 2 in the 2nd/3rd round I would look at it as a whole rather than what we did with our first pick.

Hansen (tall) and Collard +O'Brien with later picks is great (2 runners).
Gibbs (runner) and Benjamin (utility, runner) + Morton (tall) is also good.

Plenty of ways to piece it together. 3 KPP players with our first 3 picks would be a problem to fit them all into the AFL and VFL side (unless we traded before hand).

There are also some talls this year who run around like midfielders. So you could call them a tall but in reality they are hard running flankers with skill. Might end up as anything. Would not really put them into a category. I am talking about Morton, Benjamin, Everitt and Collier for example.

So in essence the key for Carlton is to not trade away any of our picks, just try to add to what we've got already. If we can trade a couple of our players for an extra couple of second rounders we could end up with 3 or 4 excellent players.

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There's so much I could say...

I reckon Port will clean us next week.

if we cant beat them then maybe we will wn only 3?

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Keep our picks and take the best player with each. Faced with similar types in talent then go with the runner. Develop our existing players as much as possible by playing them in postions that count in the AFL and VFL and start to sort them out slowly and systematically starting right now. Prmote kids from the VFL who are physically ready and are in good form. Do not bring a kid up who is struggling like we did with JR and Setanta earlier in the year. JR is ready for some AFL now but Setanta is not.

Dont bother with top ups. Take the hit and have a bit of courage in the draft and also for selctions and team plans for the rest of the year.

yeah .. did you see some of denis's turnovers ... hopeless


oh wait, he's not actually on the ground kicking the ball

i think some of the goals we gifted them may have also help their momemtum !

it must be so frustrating in the box watching our players give up the ball so easily ..


.. go blues ..

we will only win 3 games........ well im hoping

Another one. Why do people say this, it's niave at best and sillt at worst. Why have a coach, if skills aren't one of his jobs. I thought it would've been an important coaching aspects.

I say this because people seem to love blaming the coach, but how can they implement any sort of plan when the players cant hit a target .. even when in the clear..

from all reports the skills at training are as good as any .. so to call me "niave at best and sillt" because i'm not sinking the boots into denis is just as "niave and sillt"

houlihan for example .. we love to pump him up as the "silkiest skilled" player on the list .. but the number of targets he misses is unbelievable !

is that denis's fault .. am i being silly ?


.. go blues ..