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PostPosted: Thu Jun 01, 2006 4:27 pm 
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Trevor Keogh

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gerry atric wrote:
I've got to say I loved SOS as a player, but he doesn't sttrike me as the coaching type. He seems to speak in cliches, and his TV comments indicate he's not great at thinking on his feet or articulating any particularly insightful ideas.

I like Ratts, but the main query with him is that he seems a little unreliable. He was at Melbourne a year, then left tho they rated him highly. Then I think he went to SA to be a senior caoch, something he wanted to do now because of the age of his kids, at least that's the reason he gave Melbourne publicly, now he is back coaching second grade EFL. I don't know why he didn't stay at Melb for the three years, he would be in a much stronger position now given that virtually every caoch employed in the last 20 years has come via assistant role at AFL.

Be interesting to see which way Denis jumps if his assistants are sacked and he's told who he is to take on. From comments Smorgon has made it appears that the Board have already taken some autonomy away. He looks like a defeated man to me. Anyway the Board will have to do something if we continue on as we've gone, and changing assistants is the easiest and cheapest way to go, but it may mean we have a lame duck coach.

I think DP is yesterdays man, but you need to back the coach all the way or change him, seems the board - tied into a contract they wanted - are likely to have a bob each way.


from what was reported he did a fine job as an assistant in the international rules series......


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PostPosted: Thu Jun 01, 2006 4:28 pm 
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Alex Jesaulenko
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gerry atric wrote:
I've got to say I loved SOS as a player, but he doesn't sttrike me as the coaching type. He seems to speak in cliches, and his TV comments indicate he's not great at thinking on his feet or articulating any particularly insightful ideas.

I like Ratts, but the main query with him is that he seems a little unreliable. He was at Melbourne a year, then left tho they rated him highly. Then I think he went to SA to be a senior caoch, something he wanted to do now because of the age of his kids, at least that's the reason he gave Melbourne publicly, now he is back coaching second grade EFL. I don't know why he didn't stay at Melb for the three years, he would be in a much stronger position now given that virtually every caoch employed in the last 20 years has come via assistant role at AFL.

Be interesting to see which way Denis jumps if his assistants are sacked and he's told who he is to take on. From comments Smorgon has made it appears that the Board have already taken some autonomy away. He looks like a defeated man to me. Anyway the Board will have to do something if we continue on as we've gone, and changing assistants is the easiest and cheapest way to go, but it may mean we have a lame duck coach.

I think DP is yesterdays man, but you need to back the coach all the way or change him, seems the board - tied into a contract they wanted - are likely to have a bob each way.



I agree with you I dont believe SOS is the man: I said this in another thread and I dont back away from it:

"Silvagni has a communication problem - he is not a gifted public speaker, he cannot express his ideas succinctly or with any inspiration (and please dont give me that "speech at 3/4 time in the 99 Preliminary Final" as an example).

We dont need Teddy Whitten type "you've got to inspire me" type speeches from our coaches.

We need vision and long term plans to resurrect this football club from the abyss of:

- poor player development
- poor player training facilities
- lack of scientific approach when it comes to developing player training programs

We need to be bought into the 21st Century.

You cant get by anymore with getting a Jezza to fill the breach mid-season and bring you from bottom place to a spot in the finals in the course of one season - those irons in the fire dont exist in the AFL anymore.

We need to think outside the square - like I have said elsewhere is it Ric Charlesworth type who would be a Director of Football with all elements of Football Operations (including Match Day Coach) answerable to him, I dont know, but what I do know its better than what we have been doing for the past 4 years. "


I'm not sure Ratts is the answer - maybe as an assistant coach specialising in mid-field, I would only think that SOS would be an assistant coach type specialising in defence.

For the main coaching role we need - someone revolutionery and way out of left field. :wink:

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PostPosted: Thu Jun 01, 2006 4:29 pm 
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Trevor Keogh

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[quote=Whatever the case doubt whether Ratts can improve the performance of his protege - Justin Davies.[/quote]

well if thats an indication on how he see's talent....... i am concerned


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PostPosted: Thu Jun 01, 2006 4:34 pm 
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Alex Jesaulenko
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If all Ratts ever does is turn Justin Davies into a good contributing senior player at Carlton then that is a win as far as I am concerned, as it will show what can be done with junior player development that has been lacking at the club over the past few years. :wink:


Dont forget if it wasn't for assistant coach Ken Judge in 1995 - Ratten would have been left languishing in the back pocket and pidgeon holed as a tagger. :wink:

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PostPosted: Thu Jun 01, 2006 5:02 pm 
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Horrie Clover
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AGRO wrote:
If all Ratts ever does is turn Justin Davies into a good contributing senior player at Carlton then that is a win as far as I am concerned, as it will show what can be done with junior player development that has been lacking at the club over the past few years. :wink:


Dont forget if it wasn't for assistant coach Ken Judge in 1995 - Ratten would have been left languishing in the back pocket and pidgeon holed as a tagger. :wink:


Davies hasnt played much this year. I reckon Ratts wouldnt really cut it as a coach. He doesnt seem the type, ANYWAY you were the one saying in that previous "SOS" cant coach thread that Carlton needs to look outside of the Carlton mold if we are going to take a step forward? 8)

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PostPosted: Thu Jun 01, 2006 5:16 pm 
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Alex Jesaulenko
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blueblood95 wrote:
AGRO wrote:
If all Ratts ever does is turn Justin Davies into a good contributing senior player at Carlton then that is a win as far as I am concerned, as it will show what can be done with junior player development that has been lacking at the club over the past few years. :wink:


Dont forget if it wasn't for assistant coach Ken Judge in 1995 - Ratten would have been left languishing in the back pocket and pidgeon holed as a tagger. :wink:


Davies hasnt played much this year. I reckon Ratts wouldnt really cut it as a coach. He doesnt seem the type, ANYWAY you were the one saying in that previous "SOS" cant coach thread that Carlton needs to look outside of the Carlton mold if we are going to take a step forward? 8)


I said if all Ratts ever does is turn Davies into a contributing senior player then it is a win - ie. as an assistant coach not as a Senior Coach.

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PostPosted: Thu Jun 01, 2006 5:27 pm 
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Robert Walls

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Ratts seemed to do very impressive work with the Melbourne midfield when he was there. Scott Thompson and Travis Johnston seemed to benefit.


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PostPosted: Thu Jun 01, 2006 5:27 pm 
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Harry Vallence

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Synbad wrote:
The board , i dont think has faith in Mitchell to do the job.. he isnt 'big name enough'... theyre ultimate was for SOS to take over after Denis.. but this has kind of snuck up on them... i agree it looks like they will turn to Ratten and SOS...

From what i understand it wont be Mitchell.


Out of SOS and Ratten, I would take Ratten, if I had no other choice.

Having said this, I don't want our next coach to be from a familiar environment (Carlton). We need outside influence, not past Carlton influence.

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PostPosted: Thu Jun 01, 2006 5:28 pm 
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Horrie Clover
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I reckon you were right in the first place.

WE NEED NEW BLOOD
INFACT...A BLOODT TRANSFUSION
No Ratten, no SOS, no more spirited past shadows, just some real brains and new life.

You were right in the first place AGRO

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PostPosted: Thu Jun 01, 2006 11:46 pm 
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Bruce Doull
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ballistic blues wrote:
gerry atric wrote:
I've got to say I loved SOS as a player, but he doesn't sttrike me as the coaching type. He seems to speak in cliches, and his TV comments indicate he's not great at thinking on his feet or articulating any particularly insightful ideas.

I like Ratts, but the main query with him is that he seems a little unreliable. He was at Melbourne a year, then left tho they rated him highly. Then I think he went to SA to be a senior caoch, something he wanted to do now because of the age of his kids, at least that's the reason he gave Melbourne publicly, now he is back coaching second grade EFL. I don't know why he didn't stay at Melb for the three years, he would be in a much stronger position now given that virtually every caoch employed in the last 20 years has come via assistant role at AFL.

Be interesting to see which way Denis jumps if his assistants are sacked and he's told who he is to take on. From comments Smorgon has made it appears that the Board have already taken some autonomy away. He looks like a defeated man to me. Anyway the Board will have to do something if we continue on as we've gone, and changing assistants is the easiest and cheapest way to go, but it may mean we have a lame duck coach.

I think DP is yesterdays man, but you need to back the coach all the way or change him, seems the board - tied into a contract they wanted - are likely to have a bob each way.


from what was reported he did a fine job as an assistant in the international rules series......


In that case we should go poach the Irish coaches as well as their players...

Get two of them.. so we have a right hand man and a left hand man...

We dont want our coach to be a one handed man in terms of assistant coaches...

That would make Denis handicapped....

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PostPosted: Fri Jun 02, 2006 12:13 am 
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Trevor Keogh
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i don't think SOS is a good coach in terms of tactics and game play, but he would be great as a skills coach, he doesn't have to sit in the coach's box during game day, just come down to the club during training and teach a few things to the kids.


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PostPosted: Fri Jun 02, 2006 3:09 am 
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Rod Ashman
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What about Kenny Sheldon? Does he have a future down at the club in any capacity? I love listening to him on SEN. He just has so much passion for the game and the Navy Blues. Sorry to hijack the thread.


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PostPosted: Fri Jun 02, 2006 7:31 am 
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Harry Vallence
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marciblue wrote:
Ratten would be a fantastic get. The players at Melbourne couldn't speak highly enough of him for his short time at the dees. All say he had a major impact on their development and really got them up and about, more specifically the midfielders. Even though they were bound to have a good year in 2004 (being an even number!) Ratts was a great presence and influence.


Interesting.

My mail was the opposite. That he didn't connect, and that he clashed with the coaching staff. that was why he left after only 1 season.

My source is by no means authoritative, but there do seem to be a coupkle of versions floating around.

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PostPosted: Fri Jun 02, 2006 7:55 am 
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Harry Vallence

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The Vet wrote:

Interesting.

My mail was the opposite. That he didn't connect, and that he clashed with the coaching staff. that was why he left after only 1 season.

My source is by no means authoritative, but there do seem to be a coupkle of versions floating around.



Vet,

That is`what i have heard as well


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PostPosted: Fri Jun 02, 2006 8:08 am 
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Bruce Doull
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If we can get Ratts in, we can piss Liberatore off out the door.

2 reasons to do it, in my books!

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PostPosted: Fri Jun 02, 2006 10:59 am 
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Craig Bradley

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My mail from a mate who works at the Doggis is that SOS is pretty much useless as an assistant. Doesn't do much, just walks around the place does the occasional session with the backs, then goes home...

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PostPosted: Fri Jun 02, 2006 6:37 pm 
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**TROLL**

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Hmm Bret Ratten..i think he will be good for Carlton 2, 3 years after hes signed up as coach but not the first because he hasnt ever really coached a major vfl or afl side before.


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