Waite to CHB.

Tell him is playing there all next year so he better make a fist of it.
He has been in the system for a while now. Has a mature strong body. Is only 23.

No point trading him for a pick then hoping we can get a CHB with the pick who might be good in 5 years time.

Do a Leppa !

Lucas and Kouta both learned a lot about footy playing there.

This is the problem, Verbs. People are just happy to strut out your above stats and pretend everything's ok. No one's denying his upside, which is potentially huge - we're just pointing out his downside, which is in reality huge. He has a high error rate; his frees against are double his frees for (he's the 6th highest frees-against player in the League); he goes to ground too easy and too often; poor defensive skills (including allowing the opposition to play-on); he's taken to arguing with the umpy while his opponent plays on; sure he gets goals but he misses a lot of sitters; he messes up the easy things while doing the occasionally difficult; and he disappears from the game for long periods; etc. These things cost the team tremendously, put unnecessary pressure on his teammates and can cost us impetus during a game.

He's had 5 years to work on these AFL basics. Either no one on the coaching staff is helping him or he's just too dumb to learn. He should have had a substantial run in a back line position by now as part of his development - where he can get immediate feedback on just how much his errors cost the team (I'm sure Thorny would let him know). We, in the coming year, should be concentrating on developing our young blokes, not a 24 yr old who's been in the system 6 yrs.

What if it were two?

How many players do we have who can over 30 goals in a season? If he's kicking goals, then what's the problem? Should he be kicking 50 goals a season? Or should he be doing the opposite of these so called "downside" things and kicking 10 goals a season?

Jarrod Waite = Chris Tarrant

Spot on. Would be nice to be able to afford a specialist coach in this area...

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"The best argument against democracy is a five-minute conversation with the average voter" - Winston Churchill.

He try to get into your car?

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"One of my favorite philosophical tenets is that people will agree with you only if they already agree with you. You do not change people's minds." - Frank Zappa

Sometimes I wonder whether you just play dumb for the sake of an arguement or .....

You can play the man if you want to, doesn't do you any favours though.

It sounds like people expect Waite to be some sort of super hero. What he is is someone who can kick over 30 goals in a season, and at the moment there aren't many others at Carlton good enough to do that.

Waite has been tried at CHB and failed, but then the times he has failed have been when we're down by 10 goals and he's been moved on to a gun forward.

A big advantage of him playing in the backline is that he isn't a great mark, prefering chest marks to overhead and not being a good one grab mark. That would be shown up less.

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"The ability to speak doesn't make you intelligent." Qui-Gon Jinn 15-05-2005

"there’s more chance of me becoming the full forward for the [Western Bulldogs] than there is of any change in the Labor Party." Julia Gillard 18-05-2010

Jarrod Waite will become a good player when he narrows the gap between his good performances and his poor performances. We need consistency in performance from 5+ year players.

Sorry Verbs - did I hurt you? If the best you can do is the old "playing the man" counter-arguement, then I guess the answer must be "or".

Answer me this Oh Hurt One, if Waite can clean up some of his basic skill errors (and they are basic) do you think he can still get his 30 goals and be much more value to the team and our development?

I'm sure he, and 34 other guys, can clean up their basic skill errors (and they are basic) but Waite is streets ahead of virtually all of them in the goal kicking stakes.

I agree with that except the part about senior players cruising. Fevola is right there next to him doing all the hard things. Waite doesn't have to look very far for an example to follow.

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"We used to sit around and talk about how bad the game plan was." Anthony Koutoufides

It would be nice if you could stick to discussing Waite and not insinuating things about other posters.

verbs has a good point. Fev is the focal point of our attack and not many forward lines have 2 playing kicking over 50 goals. To have Waite capable of kicking 40 goals is fortunate. The question is whether we can have someone else step into that role allow Waite to be used elsewhere.

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"The ability to speak doesn't make you intelligent." Qui-Gon Jinn 15-05-2005

"there’s more chance of me becoming the full forward for the [Western Bulldogs] than there is of any change in the Labor Party." Julia Gillard 18-05-2010

Was the question too difficult, Verbs? a simple yes or no would have sufficed.

Let me simplifiy it just for you, mate. Pick the best option:

A
See Waite drop the easy mark
See Waite fall over
See his opponent run free downfield
See the opposition kick another goal

or

B
See Waite hold the easy mark
See Waite stay on his feet
See Waite wheel around towards our goals
See Carlton kick another goal

A or B Verbs?

I've seen all eight things happen pretty much every game. With 51 goals in his past 30 games, I've seen much more of the last four things happen though. He's not perfect (but no-one in our team is), but he's been our second best goal scoring option behind Fevola for the past two years.

In a perfect world Fevola would be at Full Forward, a fully developed Kennedy (with 2 pre-seasons under his belt) would be at Centre Half Forward and a Waite would be a dangerous floating 3rd tall, you would have Fisher (with a bigger aerobic capacity) linking/running up between half-back and half-forward.

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"Hence you will not say that Greeks fight like heroes but that heroes fight like Greeks"?

Winston Churchill

Maybe he is pacing himself to run out games better as that was a weakness of his in previous seasons. I remember rd 1 last year he had an awesome first quarter where he was running around like a headless chook but ran out of steam after that. Really though you would rather all players go as hard as they can then come off for a breather to keep them fresh.

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"We used to sit around and talk about how bad the game plan was." Anthony Koutoufides

Ok mate, if your happy to take the 51 goals along with 131 errors, 48 frees against, the falling over, the missed sitters, the over committed tackles and the the long walkabouts, more power to you and your anti-development stance.

We're all happy with the 51 goals - some of us would like to see him realise his full potential by dramatically improving in the areas mentioned.

Your not GuruJane on BigFooty, are you?