Well I spose it would be better if every single pick was analysed instead of him picking and choosing to suit his article.

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The problem will be made. for the solution to be sold, to your face before your eyes, tolerance is now the new danger

Appreciate that and I am happy with Wayne Hughes and his new crew and looking forward to this upcoming draft.
I also appreciate the resource situation in comparison to the other heavy weight clubs and the unlevel playing field as far as developing younger players in comparison to SA/WA clubs.

I also hope Denis Pagans need for instant success to remedy his own career problems doesnt impact on Wayne Hughes and his teams decision making.....unlike Denis we are all in it for the long haul and dont need him making too many short term decisions as Tyrants was happy to point out in one of his most recent topics...

re: Shane OSullivan..maybe one day he can tell his story and let some of his critics(your truly) understand how he was overuled by David Parkin?Elliott? etc.....would luv to hear his side of the story and judge him on that as well as the obvious stuff we have to go on...

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"When you have the attitude of a champion, you see adversity as your
training partner."
- Conor Gillen

Totally fair.

Regards Cazzesman

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Ricky Gervais - “Everyone has the right to hold whatever beliefs they want. And everyone else has the right to find those beliefs f***ing ridiculous.”

Shane had good success at the tail of the draft - Hamill, Houlihan, etc. These guys just weren't on the horizon. However, he does have his share of blame at the top end. He was unlucky - injury ravaged guys like Livo, for example. And he certainly was a victim of our "quick fix" recruiting mentality. But some of the guys we recruited with high picks he has to wear.

Oops... my mistake... thought you'd done an 'evil' paraphrase of my stuff.

This to me is the key risk for Carlton in the next couple of months. Any jumpstarting of the list without picking the best player runs the risk of diminishing our long term flag aspirations. To go through all this pain and only come up with a few finals performances in say 2008-2009 would undermine the whole thing...

What else do you want me to do with him?

Do you seriously believe we're on the path to winning a flag in the long term?

Long term = 7-10 years?

I believe it has to be the plan fo any football Club. Structuring our list accordingly is the challenge.

When you look at the talent WCE have structured their list around, yet they haven't won it (nor are they any certainty to this year), or say the Saints, well it's obviously quite a challenge indeed.

I thought 2006 would be considered a perfect year for Carlton. Through many games we were very competitive, secured the number 1 draft choice and set ourselves up for a real crack at 1 & 2 next year.

Damian Barrett what are you thinking? Ryan Crowley an integral part of the team.......pffffttt and more pffttt....

I'd have him Rod.
Got that tough edge we lack a bit of. What about trade fisher for him?

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This might sound extreme in the context of alleged sexual assault, drunken violence and a drug trafficking charge...

You talk a load of rubbish It's possible for a recruiting officer to do a great job, and end up with no players from a draft on the list 6 years later,duhhhhhhh

You went digging for something to have a go at me about?

Of course a recruiter can make the right decisions based on the information available at the time and end up with no players making it. There are many factors, impossible to predict that can cause a player's career to not reach its potential.

Injuries have ruined many players careers, is that somehow the fault of the bloke who recruited them? Was it a wrong decision by the recruiter to pick them? I don't think so.

What about say a young player who loses a family member suddenly and doesn't cope with it well? Perhaps this player was a talented player, who fell to the third round because it was known that he was very close to his family and would need a lot of help to settle in a differnent city. It was a risk to pick him, but for a third rounder his talent made it a worth while gamble. Was it a wrong decision by the recruiter to pick them? I don't think so.

I'm not saying I'm happy things don't work out. Nor that we haven't made mistakes in the past. Just that's it isn't anywhere nearly as simply as looking back 6 years later and saying tick or cross based on how many are on the list.

Except when its all crosses against all those names and the reason for it is a lack of talent. The temperament and work-rate of the 2000 crew has never been questioned, they are just not good enough.

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In WADA we trust

I agree about temperament, especially Wiggins and Livingston both seem to be great club men who do everything they need to do for their footy.

But Livingston has had some serious injuries along the way. Even now he struggles with back problems on a game to game basis. Sporn has also had injury problems and no longer looks the player he was in his first couple of years.

It's been said many times that Livingston was picked as the "next best tall" rather than the "next best player". If this is the case then I think that was a mistake, not necessarily for how it turned out, but for the process behind the decision.

As far as talent, I know nothing about how the players were rated as juniors, so I can't comment on that. If you saw them play as juniors, and can offer some insight into where we went wrong with them, then that would add a lot to the discussion.

If you think I'm defending out drafting in 2000, then you've misunderstood. I'm just saying that to judge recruiting based only on how many players are on the list 6 years later is pointless and wrong, unless you just want to bitch and moan.

I'm not having a go ... I'm just saying that recruiting has to be judged at some point. I'm all for the injury excuse - if it's justifed. I just don't think it has impacted that much on Sporn and Wiggins, Livo may be a different story.

Thats the problem with the old Carlton approach to recruiting and trading away those top picks consistently. By only really being involved heavily in one draft the risk factor was high ... and the gamble didn't come off in any way as that year turned out to be relatively poor across the board after picks 1, 2 and 3. This is a broader match committee issue.

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In WADA we trust

Absolutely agree, our recruitment and trading policies cost us dearly. Our drafting probably wasn't that great, but we didn't give ourselves very many chances.