I notice in Jim Wilson’s latest piece in the H/S that the AGM has been postponed back till March next year.
For me that’s leaving things too late as the new season is just about ready to kick off and the club should be settled for the coming seasons.
I get the impression most Carlton members aren’t satisfied with the current CFC Board and are prepared to vote for change.
If a rival (semi) ticket isn’t formed to force an EGM in the next few weeks, should the general membership base take action and force a spill of the Board before Christmas to get things sorted out and settled and get some $$$$ back into the club for the next few years?

I thought things might’ve been starting to move towards change but I get the impression that ‘politics’ are clagging things up too much.

There needs to be substantial change at Board level and the sooner the better.

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There's so much I could say...

should get this up as a poll, budzy!!

There are many pushing for change at board level, be it partial or total.

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For some silly reason, you people want to assassinate him, and it's just rubbish. You people. All of you, ALL of you!

How about an alternative ticket or some people putting their hand up to contest seats (and thus a plan) before we force a spill?

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29 different attributes,
And only 7 that you like;
20 ways to see the world,
Or 20 ways to start a fight.

I hope it is sooner rather than later.

If a new ticket is being formed and 100 sigs collected in order to force a spill then I hope the timing is good for the club.

The draft period (November 25th and the week or two afterwards) is going to be very important for the club with regards to selling memberships. We will have a shiny new number one draft pick to show off and promoting that player will be a huge positive for the club.

I hope whatever happens it happens at a time that does not interfere with this very important time for the club's marketing.

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|♥♥♥♥♥♥| http://www.blueseum.org |♥♥♥♥♥♥|

It probably can't happen (I am not an expert on the CFC Constitution) but I would prefer that "change" happens before the draft.

The last thing we want is some brand spanking bunch of new draft picks coming to the club and seeing it fight an internal war. Remember first impressions last.....we don't want Gibbs looking at doing 2 years compulsory service and then returning home to Adelaide.

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Confucius say "Virginity like bubble, one prick all gone"

Jimmae, from all reports there are willing (cashed up & influential) people in the background but it seems there's a whole lot of scratching around going on with everybody looking at everybody...waiting.... It just needs to be kickstarted one way or the other in this offseason period IMO before the serious footy stuff starts next year.

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There's so much I could say...

The final list lodgement prior to the draft has to tbe the cut off IMO. If the coach is sacked, we need a new one in place for the influx of kids coming in and fine tune the playing list to how they want it.

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Mjonc signing off at 8888

I have 2 main thoughts.

a. If a ticket is being formed, then it needs to be soon (agree prior to Xmas) and they need to have a proposed plan prior to this. Then force to EGM and have the vote. Do not just spill the board without anything in place to replace it.

b. If this tikcet for whatever reason does not materialise, I am not too fussed about the date for the AGM.

Either way, it is getting towards put up or shut up time.

Reports from forum members and media have the decision after the spring carnival.

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Mjonc signing off at 8888

Any reason why then Jon?

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Mens sana in corpore sano.

Bring back the laurel wreath logo!!!

I can't commit to the poll, given there needs to be conditions attached with that. ie yes/no doesn't equate to a better outcome. If there was an alternative board, it would have happened, and it's obvious that it isn't ready, so doing things in haste is stupid and disorganised.

jimmae wrote



I'm with jimmae on this one....I don't vote blindly, and I don't want to spill a board when there is no alternative...that's anarchy...that's ridiculous...that's very dangerous.

Is young Cam up to his old naive tricks again?

Is there weapons of mass destruction at board level? Who makes up the friendly alliance force in the interim? Interim!!!! No way....I need something more concrete.

budzy wrote



But that group is still sounding out...and will bring $M's to the club, so when/if that happens then that will be good for the club and for the future of Gibbs, Walker, Murphy, Kennedy, Bower etc....and not too disheartening. Imagine a $10M injection...and emancipation from the AFL. I will breathe far more easier when that happens.

mjonc wrote



But the most important thing for me in the meantime is the 2002 PP. If the current board is going to do something about that it would have, so if there is a group whose intent is to fight for that before the draft, then bring it on NOW!!

If it's just the money coming with a new ticket, that will happen when they're ready, with their plan and with the 100 votes...lets wait till they're ready; the ticket must be put together first...and that will take as long as it takes...and that will be followed with the launch of their plan.

I'm not fussed if it happens before or after xmas, unless the 2002 PP is in jeopardy. Otherwise the aim should be March, so that the members happy with the status quo become members before the season, and those that want change, and wont buy memberships till change happens, will buy them in support of the new regime. Win/win for the club.

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Everyone looks good in Navy Blue

No idea, Synbad might be able to answer it?

PS: Its Matt, Jon is my middle name

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Mjonc signing off at 8888

Bondiblue, what are your thoughts then in regards to the coaching situation. Assuming the new ticket wishes to install a new coach, then I would think the sooner this happens the better. I wouldn't want a new coach coming in, in March. Not a debate on Pagan, but on possible timings.

You need an alternate ticket before you starting wasting your time with EGM's....there are rumours of high flyers but maybe they are waiting to see if Denis will fall on his sword as the wagons seem to be circling around him....
Bit like Nth and Sth Korea with two factions in the footy dept.....and an uneasy truce....
I'll tip Ratten will be senior coaching by next seasons end....if we start the seasons with a poor wizard cup then a string of losses then Smorgon/Sticks will knife Pagan ....make Ratten coach and then say they had to do it....in reality it will be more about Smorgon and Sticks shoring up their own jobs...

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"When you have the attitude of a champion, you see adversity as your
training partner."
- Conor Gillen

Sometimes in life you have to kickstart things and force things into action.
It's like those domino trains...push the first one and everything follows.

...hoping wishing imagining praying doesn't get anything done!

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There's so much I could say...

Aha! Sorry Matt, for some reason I thought you were the Man City supporter on here, so I figured it was Man Jon City!!

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Mens sana in corpore sano.

Bring back the laurel wreath logo!!!

SA Blue wrote



Well there's a lot of ways to look at it.

My thoughts would start with questioning the necessity and then look at the cost, and from that I will determine for myself if there is a better result; short term and long term.

Do I think there is a need to change Pagan as coach?

Personally, no. That's because the only reasoning I've heard for the sacking is based on hysterical advocates who do not know all the facts, and feel that Pagan is the reason for our problems, and our last 2 spoons. It's born out of frustration. But yes it is frustrating. Spoons have a certain stench for Carltonians.

I feel that the club was given a far greater sentence than the 5 years from the AFL everyone talks about. In fact, even here on TC, we read that the blame lies with Parkin. Now bolt on the AFL penalties to Parkin's seeds of destruction, and our position is not an easily salvaged. I don't want to get into that too much...it's too disheartening...in fact I avoid the subject because it brings too many people down.

On the otherhand, if change brings hope, and we can ping the 'scapegoat', then everyone feels better, because we've arrested the culprit and we have disengaged them from our destiny (in our mind). ie straightening up the boat.

If everyone feels better, then we start to collectively talk about hope and hopefully that flows onto the squad representing us on the field.

Will everyone feel better though? Does anyone ask how the other half feel? The Pagan supporters? The board supporters? The non forum supporters? Is it all about you? Does sacking Pagan get rid of the problem or does it rid one of the association of our frustrations (whether it be our partner/husband/wife/coach) of those who were there in bad times?

I don't have the answers, and I don't believe that Ratts or Bradley or Roos or Worsfold....is necessarily a better coach than Pagan, they are in a better place and time, that's what I do know. There is no proof either way. Carlton in the last 5 years is as bad a place to be in football as you can get...and there's still a bit more pain to come; Pagan or not.

Get rid of him in March? I think that it doesn't matter. Disruption will happen either way. Will it cost us a place in the finals if we do in March? Will it cost us a flag? We all know the answer to that. It doesn't matter.

Usually you cut your losses sooner than later. I'm more concerned about other things than Pagan...he just happens to be flavour of the month and the easy target to vent our frustrations on. To me there's more important things to consider right now, and the coach is not one of them (maybe after the draft period would be better rather than now).

What about the talk of the legal challenge for the 2002 PP? Where's that gone? What about relieving us of our debt and enslavement to the AFL? What about attracting the best player in the PSD? What about making Carlton an attractive brand to sponsors and players between now and the beginning of the season? Will that happen from disruptive behaviour or not? It depends on the colour of the money a new board/ current board brings, and until we see the money, there's nothing but frustrated souls venting their anger on an anonymous public forum.

I do know that the current board do not have what it takes to rid us of this debt, but they might get us the 2002 PP. If they don't, I have no reason to vote for them, as they would have delivered me not one thing I expected for a better Carlton.

Hysteria isn't healthy. It's substance that matters to me.

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Everyone looks good in Navy Blue

Can anyone actually tell me what would be achieved by ousting the board and replacing them now .......... again.

The coaching staff is just about set for next season.
The playing roster is about to get better without question.
Players everyone has been bagging have mostly now gone.
We're still in debt and the Spew and his mates are so far up our Jimmy that we are barely making our own decisions anyway.

I just think that until we start performing on the field, we aren't going to attract money to the club to get us out of debt.

I'd hate to see a good group take over the board and not be able to achieve anything due to the situation as it stands now. They'd be on a hiding to nothing.

I'd say if we're performing better on-field next year but still underachieving off-field, they they have not excuses and will deserve to be hung and quartered.

However, if someone can tell me what a new board could actually achieve in the current environment, I'd like to hear it. Sure bring 'em in, but what can they realistically do???

.........and don't say "sack Pagan" cos that's crap and an easy out for Pagan too. He will be judged on the on-field performance next year and if that doesn't improve, he can't blame the draft, retreads, young kids, etc., etc.

If we don't improve in both departments next year, there are absolutely no excuses and then I absolutely agree ....... gaaaawn.

We don't want change just for the sake of change. There must be a positive, achievable outcome.

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^^^

Don't worry Essendon* ....... We still hate your guts

^^^

budzt wrote



Yeah, sometimes, if it's needed. Is it really needed right now? What's the cost? Is the timing right? Is there less fall out when we do it when the ducks are lined up?

I think we have time. At least we should wait until all the members who want the current status quo to renew their memberships, and the current board have done all they can do to lobby for new sponsors...then let the new board with the money, the vision and their sponsors (who support their vision) to do their thing effectively when they see it as the right time, rather than us on the outside, who will not be putting a ticket together trying to determine when the timing of change should happen.

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Everyone looks good in Navy Blue

Should this be TC's slogan? A place where frustrated souls meet?

I think most people here agree that until we see what others have to offer, it is all just talk. It will be interesting times ahead.