The most disturbing thing in this article is the concept that a group from the 95 premiership team, with Lofts and Elliott's backing are looking to take over the club. THat would be a shocking idea. If they are the same group who wanted to sack Pagan and replace him not with the best but with Mitchell or Ratts then I won't be voting for them. Maybe Anthony Pratt or similar is what we need. I won't vote for anyone who has a strong association with Elliott. We need someone with the capability to deal with an $8mil debt. Mike Fitzpatrick is the only ex Carlton player who might have the skills to do that. I doubt we will be changing our coach in March. So another year of slow development, maybe even getting the first round PP, DP out at end of 07 and then onwards and upwards.

Also a few of Caro's marks against the board were actually plusses. Broad policy of concentrating on under 25s, no ratbags (Zantuck, Gardiner) and no finals till 09. Are those decisions undermining? If in the late 90s the Board had intervened to stop recruiting hacks we'd be better off.

I too am disturbed by the thought of a 95 Premiership Team ticket backed by Elliott & Lofts.

But there is something wickedly delicious by the fact how pissed off "The Spew" and "Lazarus" will be if they believe that Elliott is somehow back in the picture at Carlton.

But then reality sets in and I realise how vindictive "The Spew" and "Lazarus" would be to Carlton if they thought that Elliott was back on the scene.

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"Hence you will not say that Greeks fight like heroes but that heroes fight like Greeks"?

Winston Churchill

All I meant by that off-the-cuff first remark was that I hate the fact that we are so consistently in the shit and I am sick to death of reading about it. I'd rather just bullshit with mates and stuff, which is what Stuff is for.



Whereas you just see fit to belittle everyone on the forum, the CFC board, the field and the coaching staff at your own leisure. Change the bloody channel.

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Cer 'ch 'n alluog Blues

well said, I don't mind an article coming out highlighting things or theorising but this is the the 4th or 5th one along these lines. Give us something new or don't write the crap.

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Between our dreams and actions lies this world

Any Elliot connection is fine with me. He won't be running the show, but his connections with Business and financial backers can't be debated and will only benefit the club.

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Mjonc signing off at 8888

Can't agree mjonc. Elliott's brains took us from the unaasailable League champions on and off the field to a debt ridden rabble. He is a dishonest, egotistical fool whose business acumen has destroyed several companies, his own personal fortune and almost the Carlton Football Club, and any influence he has is malign. I can't imagine any smart young businessman seeing him as anything other than a joke. And as for the 95 premiership team taking over the club.....the boys could play football well, but why does anyone imagine they are administrators? We need to get well beyond people of the past. Change needs to be positive, not deckchairs on the Titanic. If there are some youngish, intelligent, committed and connected businessmen out there who love the Blues, (A Pratt perhaps) then get on board. Others need not apply. Any new board has to be considerably better not just different.

I would find it really hard to support the club if that drunken old fool Elliott has any connection again.

Where did i say Elliot would be on the board? I said his connections will be beneficial to the club. Elliot might have a bad name running a Business, but his network of friends are very powerfull, any young Business man would be stupid to ignore this.

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Mjonc signing off at 8888

Love her or hate her Caro is generally pretty close to the mark. In this case she is spot on, she is the only journo with the balls to say what many of us have been thinking for a whle. The SEN team interviewwed Pagan the other day and let him dribble on without answering any important questions, it was the most pathetic interview all year and they knew it - they even admitted pagan played them like a puppet.

Good on you Caro for writing the truth.
Just cos an article has a negative slant to it doesnt mean she is anti- carlton.

The sooner pagan is gone the sooner the healing can begin. (sentiments echoed by Nick Stevens - IN person!!!)

But how Headcutter? We had a chance to maybe get rid of him with Fraser Brown and others paying out a year of his salary, and replacing him with Mitchell. Neither a great solution, we would have got a coach who probably wouldn't be our first choice and still had to find $600k for DP. Any significant change to the board probably won't take place till March, and I can't see them sacking a coach then, particularly seeing changing coaches has to be more than just installing mates like Ratts or Mitch. If we change coach we have to go through a process that gets us the best. And if we sack DP we are still left with a massive payout. I can't see how anything effective is going to happen before the end of 07, and sacking him to replace him with an insider without looking at all potential candidates is madness.

Perhaps the club is interviewing at the moment so they have someone to slot in come March.

It wouldn't surprise me if GS knifed DP to placate the masses.

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“It is a state of mind, a system of belief, a way of seeing the world, a deep faith that, because you are Carlton, you belong to something great.” - Mike Fitzpatrick articulating what Out of the Blue means.

But sheep hate the truth...they think it shows passion to ignore it

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"...that's the thing about opinion - you don't have to know anything to have one..." Andre Agassi commenting on Pat Cash 2004
"...the less you know - the more you believe..." - Bono 2006

Well you hardly want me to tell you how intelligent you are when you fail to comprehend the massive issues confronting the club do you???

And befpre you take the splinter out of my eye how about taking the plank out of your own...

When you bag me for my opinions surely youre allowing yourself to bend over with your pants around your ankles.. ???

Thats just the way things go in life... and its just another illustration of how you dont differentiate reality from fantasy...

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Due to recent budget cuts and the rising cost of electricity, gas, and oil....... the Light at the End of the Tunnel has been turned off. We apologize for the inconvenience.

I know the club's well and truly in the shit and I am sick to @#$%&! death of reading about it. And wankers like you bitching about every @#$%&! thing in sight.

You seem to specialise in making absolutely no @#$%&! sense whatsoever and taking off the cuff comments and turning them into something explosive and more than it should be.

You think I'm happy with the way we're being run at the moment? @#$%&! NO! I want to see some change in order to get those twonks out of the club as well. Whether those twonks have the initials MM, GS, SK or DP I don't care. I am sick of the @#$%&! bullshit, and I am sick of you belittleing people for your own amusement.

You can have your opinions, I don't give a shit. I'll have my own opinions as well. But are you ever going to do anything with them, or just bitch on here over and over ad @#$%&! nauseum???

Gimme a break.

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Cer 'ch 'n alluog Blues

So you prefer things teh way they are. A coach no-one wants from the players, ex-players, to the Board. If the players won't play for we're going no-where. Just pay the guy out no matter the financial imposition. With Ratten or Mitchell the players will be at least committed, which will mean a few more wins and at worst a far better run for our money. That has to be a winner on it's own. Many coaches have been sacked pre-season or mid-season and the clubs done well. If I remember Pagan himself became coach in March of 1993 during the Pre-season Cup, after North, under Schimma, were humiliated by 147pts. Remember the turnaround. Unfortunately he, himself, is now past it and going no-where here.

I dont think Schimma had a contract with $1.2mil to run on it though.

I love the people who come here and say forget about the financial implications of sacking him.

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"The ability to speak doesn't make you intelligent." Qui-Gon Jinn 15-05-2005

"there’s more chance of me becoming the full forward for the [Western Bulldogs] than there is of any change in the Labor Party." Julia Gillard 18-05-2010

Jim, we owe $1.5m to the AFL as it is. Sacking Pagan would force us to find another $1.2m odd. How are we going to find this money? I think most people agree that Denis is still there only by default, i.e. he has to stay as we can't afford to pay him out. We can't just discard the financial implications sacking Denis would bring.

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Formerly Blues-Back2003.

Caro reckons Denis won't be coaching round 1 2007. Ratten will.

She also said that the other groups have certain people in mind for the coaching position instead of interviewing a number of candidates and then deciding.

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"You are being watched. The government has a secret system. A machine that spies on you every hour of every day. I know because I built it." - Finch

Only if there is enough money to pay him out or he walks away.


Caroline Wilson - will enter Mastermind and her speciality category will be "The Bleeding Obvious".

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"Hence you will not say that Greeks fight like heroes but that heroes fight like Greeks"?

Winston Churchill

The money is already there, remember the failed attempt? If they want Pagan gone it will happen.

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Mjonc signing off at 8888