Because at least one of those names would have got snapped up. Betts and Hampson gone a year later after poor 2013 for example.
Because Mick came out and said that we wont be featuring in the trade period and he is happy with the current list.

Re: Point one - Betts was signed via FA, not traded for. Adelaide couldn't have traded for him, they didn't have any picks, remember? Tippett sanction...

Hampson - the fact the he attracted a 2nd rounder shows you that the other players you nominated were worth a hell of a lot more... unless you are now suggesting Hampson >/= Yarran?

Mick said what he had to say, for a number of reasons. Did you really expect him to say publicly that sweeping changes were required - given the nature of Ratts' exit? Do you honestly think he would not have been across the status of the salary cap in 2012/13/14 during negotiations for the job? Do you think anyone in the footy dept would have been stupid enough to guarantee him that trades could/would be made?

If you're going to base your opinion of the club's internal assessment of list construction from statements made in press conferences... well.

No worries. So the players were willing to renegotiate contracts or take pay cuts to improve the list.
What did we need to lure Cloke? 700k? 800K? a million?
Surely we could have made significant changes to the list with that sort of flexibility.

At least that puts the "hands tied due to TPP constraints" nonsense to bed.

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Looking forward to seeing our potential realised.

So to replace Yaz' output what draft pick would we need?

Betts would have attracted a 2nd rounder.
Do you think a few risks needed to be taken after 2012 list wise? Do you think the lack of taking those risks is at least partly responsible for us being in close to exactly the same position we were in at the end of round 22 2012?

Personally, I wouldn't even call them risks. To me it was a choice between watching the same thing as the previous years or mix it up and give yourself a fighting chance.

It will happen at the end of this year. 2 years too late.

Bit of a cop out there Punter.

I don't think the salary cap has anything to do with it. In fact it is a good reason we should have traded.

Have a bit of read about how big franchises in USA deal with building a list. They smash them up all the time. Sometimes they do it when close but realise they are not going to get there.
If we don't trade and keep putting the same guys out doing the same things we must learn to enjoy being average. It was obvious midway through 2012 what had to be done. It wasn't done and now it will happen in 2014. What a waste.

A cop out how? I don't think what anyone at Carlton says publicly necessarily reflects what they might be saying to each other behind closed doors when discussing players. You obviously disagree, fair enough if that's what you believe.

The US experience has little to no correlation to this at all. Some sports have fully guaranteed contracts (NBA/MLB), some partially guaranteed (NFL). There is also more flexibility (especially with NBA/MLB) to wear the financial cost of blowing things up and starting over, with no fixed salary cap to deal with. But more importantly the rules around trading are completely different. Trading future picks, trading in season and most importantly - a culture which has a history of high player movement and a willingness of teams to trade (and a lot more potential trade partners in every sport). The AFL is truly an amateur sport when it comes to player movement. I'm sure many here like it that way because of 'loyalty', whatever that is supposed to mean these days.

Relax everyone ... all is well with the world ... after all ... we did get the super duper coach.

10 years max ... and we will make the top 4.

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I am as mad as hell and I'm not going to take it any more!!!

But Mick was given 3 years to get a Flag

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Vice President, International Extreme Sarcasm Society (IESS)

Mick backed himself to get the best out of the players and change their softness and their bad habits that were instilled into them by super coach Ratts.
Most players just haven't responded because they're either lazy, mentally weak FIGJAMs (Gibbs, Waite, Murphy, Garlett) or their skills are just deplorable (Lucas, Graham, Robbo).

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James Hird and Essendon* FC - #FOREVERDRUGCHEATS

And Ratts instilled laziness, mental weakness, figjamness, and poor skills ness into the current playing list?

Demonstrate how this occurred.

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Vice President, International Extreme Sarcasm Society (IESS)

Pagan dropped Fev once for a week
Mick has dropped Yarran Waite and Garlett.
Ratts berated Curnow and Hampson but kept playing them... yes he dropped Setanta and he dropped Bower.
We have a soft list... the list was developed to Ratten's taste. He built it with a swag of early picks and he traded for it with other picks.
This is his list still... you happy?

Give Mick 5 or 6 years to be given the opportunities Ratten had....

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Due to recent budget cuts and the rising cost of electricity, gas, and oil....... the Light at the End of the Tunnel has been turned off. We apologize for the inconvenience.

We played finals 3 out of 4 years with lazy, soft, mentally weak players with deplorable skills.

You talk about peoples hate of MM blinding their judgement.
How about the hate and bullshit thrown at Ratten? Its quite probable he was a poor coach with plenty of deficiencies but some of the comparisons between Mick and Ratts are laughable.

Exactly what improvements are you seeing under Malthouse? You're happy to lay the boots into "super coach Ratts" but what exactly are you seeing now that wasn't evident for the past 5 years? (Apart from us sitting 17th on the ladder with a comparatively healthy list)

I keep hearing about us being better defensively under Mick. Well that's obviously nonsense.
I'm being told he couldn't change the list because we couldn't move with contracts in place yet we offered Cloke the best part of a million dollars.

As for Mick changing their "softness" and bad habits. Exactly what are you talking about? I'd suggest plenty of people are throwing baseless statements around presenting them as facts.
I agree Ratts wasn't the man for the job but I've seen absolutely nothing to suggest Mick is.

How about someone enlightening us with something tangible other than "the vibe"

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Looking forward to seeing our potential realised.

Yep, nothing has changed at all. Players still don't give a toss and blame everyone but themselves.

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#NewBlues beginning 25th August 2015

cultured cant be changed easily

though it will....

the real problem is away from the club with the Oligarchs.
happy to give people who are wannabes their own virtual farms.. where they can virtually build their little virtual dams and virtual pens... and feel a kind of virtual importance as theyre virtually groomed to become virtual leaders of this virtual club

But the Oligarch hold on our club is anything but virtual....

dont forget there is a virtual suggestions drop box....the virtual youth group can virtually drop their virtual ideas from their virtual brainstorming and problem solving for their inclusion into the virtual club.

Were all virtually given access to feel part of this club.
To continue look at your itunes/playstore coupon and send in another $**** to continue your virtual membershp for the Carlton football club

Thats the real issue confronting this football club today... we virtually have a footy club

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Due to recent budget cuts and the rising cost of electricity, gas, and oil....... the Light at the End of the Tunnel has been turned off. We apologize for the inconvenience.

this is virtually the first time I have heard this reference to a virtual football club. I look forward to a virtual plethora of virtually living and breathing the virtuosity of this virtual explanation of our virtually f#$%@d football club. Do we think that we can ask mr "obviously" McKay to start using Virtually instead? Macca should be given an OBE (obviously bullshit explanation) but perhaps VD (virtually desperate) would be more appropriate now?

Dont expect this group to make sacrifices at the top to allow more talent to enter so that they can improve the team. There is no history of this happening before.

The only scenario that I can see where players at the top may take a pay cut would be if the careers themselves are threatened. Selfishness motive again and not the right motive to promote a winning culture long term.

Dont hold your breath of the blues doing a Geelong.

And of course the Great Swann would sort out what sort of players we may recruit. The Clokes, the Reids, the Blairs, the Godlsachs, maybe even the Swans

What a pathetic club we have become - from top to bottom.

I lost trust in this playing list a long time ago...

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Vice President, International Extreme Sarcasm Society (IESS)

Pagan created the Fev child in his own image.

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Vice President, International Extreme Sarcasm Society (IESS)

Who created the Bradley not training with the group for his contact as captain?
Kouta with his adidas.
Campos attitude.
Lance Whitnall's professional attitude to the game etc?
You see it's culture.

The funny thing is this club has much maligned footballers, much maligned coaches, much maligned presidents, much maligned recruiters, maligned CEO , much maligned development much maligned everything... Much maligned club externally.... Much maligned because it's incompetent.
Happens to poorly run clubs...

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Due to recent budget cuts and the rising cost of electricity, gas, and oil....... the Light at the End of the Tunnel has been turned off. We apologize for the inconvenience.

...and Mick Malthouse is an experienced coach that one would think didnt need a long honey moon period to get the team up and running...

In fact MM, when he first arrived at the club (ie after he sent in Robert Wiley to run the pre season and some of the draft period, because of a book launching tour) thought that OUR list of players didnt need much tinkering. Hence the quiet 2012/13 draft period.

There is no doubt the goal from EVERYBODY at the club was to go deep into the 2013 finals - we started off zip from three, and didnt even make the finals. We needed charity entry to the finals and played the tigers in the first week - still beat them, after giving them a 6 goal start.

The next week against the swans we saw the most pathetic performance by a Carlton team in a final (IMO).

People need to stand back for a moment and look at the reality and facts rather than bagging individuals.

Everybody makes errors and in this caper, everybody is trying their best to achieve the most out fo themselves.

Does anyone think that most of the players are?

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Vice President, International Extreme Sarcasm Society (IESS)